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Rebuild about done

Back at trying to get things timed. Started from the beginning. The actual pump timing is at 30.xx, Desired @ 8.7, metered timing @ 8.7. Shifted pump toward passenger side and the metered went to 5.0. So shifted the pump again as far as it would go and it went up to 7.5. Not sure if this makes a difference but we used one of Leroy's timing gear sets instead of a timing chain. We followed the instructions that came with it. My son said he installed it correctly. Would that change anything?
 
I hope it's not the case, but seeing the actual timing at 30.+ might mean the gear for the IP might be one tooth off? when you said you moved the IP fully to one side, is the slotted stud resting on the housing or are you unable to turn it any further due to the injection lines holding it?
 
In a thread on here months ago it was revealed that there are some potential issues with the new batch of timing gears from Leroy. Unfortunately the timing gears are not as simple as "plug and play" and the cam needs to be degreed to ensure proper timing when installing the gears. I'm no engine builder and couldn't tell you where to begin in degreeing the cam on a 6.5. @Twisted Steel Performance is the engine builder who brought the potential issues with the timing gears to our attention

@Twisted Steel Performance, any insight for @Rodd and his timing issues potentially being related to the gears? How did it go installing the gears on the most recent customer build?
 
dbrannon79 said:
I hope it's not the case, but seeing the actual timing at 30.+ might mean the gear for the IP might be one tooth off? when you said you moved the IP fully to one side, is the slotted stud resting on the housing or are you unable to turn it any further due to the injection lines holding it?
Click to expand...
Good question. I will check it the next time we work on it.
 
DieselAmateur said:
In a thread on here months ago it was revealed that there are some potential issues with the new batch of timing gears from Leroy. Unfortunately the timing gears are not as simple as "plug and play" and the cam needs to be degreed to ensure proper timing when installing the gears. I'm no engine builder and couldn't tell you where to begin in degreeing the cam on a 6.5. @Twisted Steel Performance is the engine builder who brought the potential issues with the timing gears to our attention

@Twisted Steel Performance, any insight for @Rodd and his timing issues potentially being related to the gears? How did it go installing the gears on the most recent customer build?
Click to expand...
I bought the gears about 5 years ago. Just a time consuming build. Not sure how recent the issues with the gears were.
 
It's obvious you have a timing problem, could be the gears or the IP gear, seems it's past time to remove the front covers and recheck stuff. And yes the gear sets have been proven to be off, it's not known if it's a random thing or not, I found it and others have found it the hard way...
 
Twisted Steel Performance said:
It's obvious you have a timing problem, could be the gears or the IP gear, seems it's past time to remove the front covers and recheck stuff. And yes the gear sets have been proven to be off, it's not known if it's a random thing or not, I found it and others have found it the hard way...
Click to expand...
The truck runs good other than timing. I would think that if it was off by a tooth it would run rough. How would I know that the Dot on the gear is off? I'm thinking that if something is off is could be either the IP gear or the Timing gear. How can I tell which one is off if one of them is off?
 
I didn’t know there were issues with the gear drive setup.Guess we learn something new everyday……If you remove the timing cover and gear drive lay the cam gear on top of an old cam sprocket if you still have it and with the keyway notches inline with each other observe where the two dots are in relation to each other.Hopefully you’ll find some sort of a difference there and do the same with the crankshaft sprocket if you kept the old timing chain setup.
 
Sadly it sounds like your gonna have to tear down the front end to open up the timing gears and the IP gear to verify if something is off. when you get there. put the engine at TDC and post a pic of everything. Chris and others that have run into this issue can help if the gears happen to be one of the sets that might be incorrectly marked.
 
There is a guy in Canada that had a shop install gears in a brand new p400, bent all valves and pushed several through the head, needless to say some things are not as simple as it looks. The shop called me for cam specs and other info, they are just now going back together with parts, a very costly mistake.
 
Being a whole tooth off - simply laying the gears on top of a regular gear set should identify if it is off.
Line up the keyways and the dots should line up.

The guy “buckwild” with the mega turbo, nitrous, etc 6.5 runs hig set up a tooth advanced on purpose to get the timing required to run his engine.
Ip driven gear -Notching the keyway and custom keyway was my way to keeping valve timing same but advanced injection.
But I have done the cam advanced by a tooth via chain before - jumping a tooth with a tight chain didn’t hit. But with a tooth out AND stretched chain it hits.

There is 36 teeth on the chain and 48 teeth on gear drive.
360° divided by 48 teeth = 7.5° per tooth.
360° divided by 36 teeth = 10° per tooth.

Dude’s shop that had it hit had to have it 2 teeth off, 1.6 or 1.7 ratio arms, or something- if Leroy had a batch that had the dot only 1 tooth off. Procedure also calls for hand rotation of engine. Guess they didn’t do that either. It would be interesting to see what all they did, and get some pics of the timing gears. Simply counting the teeth from the keyway to the dot would tell.
 
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