• Welcome to The Truck Stop! We see you haven't REGISTERED yet.

    Your truck knowledge is missing!
    • Registration is FREE , all we need is your birthday and email. (We don't share ANY data with ANYONE)
    • We have tons of knowledge here for your diesel truck!
    • Post your own topics and reply to existing threads to help others out!
    • NO ADS! The site is fully functional and ad free!
    CLICK HERE TO REGISTER!

    Problems registering? Click here to contact us!

    Already registered, but need a PASSWORD RESET? CLICK HERE TO RESET YOUR PASSWORD!

Rebuild for a performance oriented 6.5

Easier breaking is possible, but as long as it's 3 or 4 degree max per keyway, he should be ok. Just make sure there is no slop. If he is trying to run over 100,000 miles then, yeah they will strip or snap. Performance is not longevity.

3500 hasn't told a lot about his cam, or set up- so I didn't pry. But maybe should. If you don't want to share details-it's ok. But what I've caught so far:

Regrind cam, so not as much lift and duration as stock so he is trying to shorten the power band. In doing so it becomes more important to move the range of that power band up or down in rpm to match acceleration rate and gearing. The rule of thumb is 1 degree per 100 rpm. So a 10 degree advance would move his peak torque down 1000 rpm. Colder burn on startup, and intake valve hitting piston is only concearns here.

This helps a lot keeping IP output in lower rpm so high fuel rate is easier. If still running the hx35/40 then a quick spool is going to be required to maximize the stump puller build. It will also help cool the valves better to beat egt. He just looses the top 250 rpm from the engine.

The opposite-a 10 degree retard will cost the lower end but help the easier flow top end rpm and maximize fuel savings if boost is back down to half its peak and a little more egt as the burn gets to the exhaust valves a bit more. Or if he is pouring on the coal at high rpm and able to ramp boost to the peak, like a little fuel kicker (propane or meth wmi) can push his torque curve up closer to the horsepower curve. The danger here is burning valves, increased egt, exhaust valve hit piston.

If we see you hooking up to a tractor sled, I guess we know.:D


I haven't said much about the cam bc I am more or less testing it to see if it will even work on the 6.5 the way it does on the Fords. He has some of the info on it posted on his site. It is machined to the same specs as his stage 1 cam for the Fords. These are the advertised specs:
Intake Duration: 178*@.050"
Exhaust Duration 190*@.050"
Lobe Sep: 108*
Lift: Int .410"/ Exh .412"

Comparing it to the specs given on SS Diesels site for his performance cam (which I was thinking was the same as the marine cam Peninsular sells), intake duration is the same, exhaust is less. Lift is also less. Per his instructions of where to set the intake centerline, his icl is roughly 10 degrees more (110-112 vs 101). Since it is not my cam grind and I am running it more or less to test it, I don't feel like it is my place to give out much more info than what he already publicly gives out. Now if it works out and he is able to market these to the 6.5 crowd, then by all means, be as curious as you want with him on all the details[emoji4].

On my end, I think I've shared everything I have done, or plan to do with the engine. I will still be running the same modified marine pump and hx35/40 hybrid as of right now. I will be running the Harland Sharp 1.6 roller rockers so long as they will work on it. I will still be running an intercooler. The only thing that may change there is that I would like to move it to behind the grill, but the one I am currently running will not work there. So that's still up in the air.

The only other possible change will be the exhaust manifolds and converting it to centermount. But that part is still up in the air. I contemplated changing the precups to larger ones, but for the time being I am just going to leave the factory diamonds. Other than that, I haven't made any secret changes unless I've forgotten to mention it along the way. And if I end up changing anything or doing anything more, I will happily post it on here. I like to feel like I have a one of a kind truck/build, but I also don't mind sharing the details to help others along the way or to get advice from others who may have tried the same things. I don't build these for a living so I don't have to keep anything secret to get people to come pay me to build their engine. But if you want to pay me to build you one, I'll gladly spend your money[emoji4].


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I appreciate your sharing the info. The only reason I never put out info on the set up I had is free parts were a requirement, and I could build 2 engines exactly the same, 1 might last 3 weeks and the other 1/2 hour. Granted the fuel mix was most likely responsible, it didn't like just diesel.

I think your going to like that duration. :)
 
Lol 3 weeks or 1/2 hr. The first time I read that I misread it as three years. I guess if your going for broke and all out, three weeks isn't so bad...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Although if mine only lasts three weeks I will probably cut my losses and just shoot myself in the face lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
3 weeks was good. Keep in mind this was drag strip only truck (well a couple times to the illegal drags on west Tropicana Ave.). All red fiberglass and 1" off the ground and orange flames out the half stacks was kind of a cop attention grabber for some reason.
 
3 weeks was good. Keep in mind this was drag strip only truck (well a couple times to the illegal drags on west Tropicana Ave.). All red fiberglass and 1" off the ground and orange flames out the half stacks was kind of a cop attention grabber for some reason.
Are you still talking about a 6.5 powered truck? What did it run in the 1/4?
 
It was a 6.5, but not just diesel. Best ever was 10.90 at 125. Weighed in just under 3500 with driver. Really it was more like high 11s -most runs ended in a boom before the traps. It was a drag truck my buddy owned and was saving up to replace the blown alcohol engine it normally ran. During off an season we dropped in 6.5s donated by GM for testing and swapped in a 6.14 12 bolt on the 4link and a th400. Most everything we did to that doesn't apply to DD trucks, but was fun.
 
Not just diesel? So you were running a healthy dose of propane/nitrous/WM to help fuel it, I take it?
 
It was a 6.5, but not just diesel. Best ever was 10.90 at 125. Weighed in just under 3500 with driver. Really it was more like high 11s -most runs ended in a boom before the traps. It was a drag truck my buddy owned and was saving up to replace the blown alcohol engine it normally ran. During off an season we dropped in 6.5s donated by GM for testing and swapped in a 6.14 12 bolt on the 4link and a th400. Most everything we did to that doesn't apply to DD trucks, but was fun.

And this is where I make fun of the light duty drag strip stuff. It only has to go 1/4 mile (11-20 seconds) at full power. Or should I say: Has trouble even going 1/4 mile! Much harder to keep things from going "Boom!" at full power while towing a extreme grade that goes on for miles. Not saying that the race truck can't tow it's own tool trailer to the track, but, more common to be on the trailer behind say my truck. I mean one truck lost the LS2 shootout because they were snapping 3/4 full float axle shafts clean in half. o_O On the paved road! Usually gotta go offroad to do that.
 
And this is where I make fun of the light duty drag strip stuff. It only has to go 1/4 mile (11-20 seconds) at full power. Or should I say: Has trouble even going 1/4 mile! Much harder to keep things from going "Boom!" at full power while towing a extreme grade that goes on for miles. Not saying that the race truck can't tow it's own tool trailer to the track, but, more common to be on the trailer behind say my truck. I mean one truck lost the LS2 shootout because they were snapping 3/4 full float axle shafts clean in half. o_O On the paved road! Usually gotta go offroad to do that.
I agree with you WW, those are definitely 2 unique purposes for a vehicle or engine. My only hesitation with the upgrades I am doing to my engine is making it survive under towing loads - if I was just daily driving all the time, then I would have no apprehension at all. The thing that set my mind at ease a bit more was seeing that 3500_6.5 was towing with the high fuel rate and he was making a stock long block (though the better 2000 long block) do it and survive while towing loads heavier than I ever will with mine.

I was interested in hearing more about Will's escapades because it's fun to hear what one can do if they really try and uniquediesel's truck was the only other one I had seen as a dedicated drag effort.

I hadn't heard about the LS2 shootout. That sounds sick snapping axle shafts!
 
Finally getting a chance to degree my cam. I ended up one tooth off on the cam to get it close. It currently sits at an icl of 114.5*. Spec is 110*-112*. So looks like I will have to get some offset keys and see if I can get it where I need it to be. Wasn't too bad though. I had to move the cam a total of three times to get here. Once I got to the 114.5*, I triple checked everything to make sure I didn't figure it wrong.

Basically, all I did was got to max lift, then go down the lobe .050" on either side of max lift. Add the two numbers together, divide by two.

To find tdc of the piston to set the degree wheel, you just guess at tdc and set the wheel to zero. The. Move it off tdc and set the stop at X degree (any number will do), then go the opposite direction until it hits the stop. Check the degree it is on. If you have tdc, they should be the same degree. I was off a couple degrees, so you add the two together and divide by two. That gives you the correct degree to set it at. Then go to both stops again and both directions should hit the stop at the same degree. I don't have pictures of that unfortunately. I may do it again so I can get pictures for anyone interested. But I'll probably start a separate cam thread for all of those details.

Here's the pictures of checking the intake centerline.

Set the dial indicator to zero at zero lift on number one intake lobe.
e430e148129c79d71c0f7a691add8fe6.jpg



Now find max lift (mine was .275")
683c63d6080402343c61454366dc491e.jpg


Now go back .050" (.225")
f51af492da9fd556dabf87635d9db151.jpg


Check and record the degree
4b64846b5d01b39584e2630710cffb70.jpg


Now go back the other direction to .050" below max lift
5228028ef4d8044b067ddf6388af18c5.jpg


Check and record degree
2a7fcea55622c13d6335ed7140d6b3a5.jpg


Add degrees together and divide by two. That gives you intake centerline.

I double and triple checked all measurements to make sure I could duplicate all numbers that I got. I got the same numbers for everything every time. So I think it's safe to say that I am right at 114.5. Now time to wait on keys.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Geez, I never got a single notification of any of the comments on this thread since my last post. Tapatalk is slacking.... It is notifying me ever 30 seconds on Nate's build but not once on my own lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Finally getting a chance to degree my cam. I ended up one tooth off on the cam to get it close. It currently sits at an icl of 114.5*. Spec is 110*-112*. So looks like I will have to get some offset keys and see if I can get it where I need it to be. Wasn't too bad though. I had to move the cam a total of three times to get here. Once I got to the 114.5*, I triple checked everything to make sure I didn't figure it wrong.

Basically, all I did was got to max lift, then go down the lobe .050" on either side of max lift. Add the two numbers together, divide by two.

To find tdc of the piston to set the degree wheel, you just guess at tdc and set the wheel to zero. The. Move it off tdc and set the stop at X degree (any number will do), then go the opposite direction until it hits the stop. Check the degree it is on. If you have tdc, they should be the same degree. I was off a couple degrees, so you add the two together and divide by two. That gives you the correct degree to set it at. Then go to both stops again and both directions should hit the stop at the same degree. I don't have pictures of that unfortunately. I may do it again so I can get pictures for anyone interested. But I'll probably start a separate cam thread for all of those details.

Here's the pictures of checking the intake centerline.

Set the dial indicator to zero at zero lift on number one intake lobe.
e430e148129c79d71c0f7a691add8fe6.jpg



Now find max lift (mine was .275")
683c63d6080402343c61454366dc491e.jpg


Now go back .050" (.225")
f51af492da9fd556dabf87635d9db151.jpg


Check and record the degree
4b64846b5d01b39584e2630710cffb70.jpg


Now go back the other direction to .050" below max lift
5228028ef4d8044b067ddf6388af18c5.jpg


Check and record degree
2a7fcea55622c13d6335ed7140d6b3a5.jpg


Add degrees together and divide by two. That gives you intake centerline.

I double and triple checked all measurements to make sure I could duplicate all numbers that I got. I got the same numbers for everything every time. So I think it's safe to say that I am right at 114.5. Now time to wait on keys.....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Great info! I'm interested to see your valve to piston clearances.
 
Geez, I never got a single notification of any of the comments on this thread since my last post. Tapatalk is slacking.... It is notifying me ever 30 seconds on Nate's build but not once on my own lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I get that every once in a while with this site, not Tapatalk, not sure why.

And I thought you were just disgusted with us for derailing your thread ;)
 
I see you are running a geardrive , good . That helps . I would have run the crank thru a whole rotation . Reason being that what if the lobes are not symmetrical ? The ICL would be off .
Dead on with the TDC .
Your specs are different than my Crane . I have more lift and duration but you have about 10 degrees more ICL . I guess we'll see how it runs .
 
For new pics the measuring tool pics need a different angle or other than black color on the measuring rod. At first it looked like you were measuring the piston depth as the measuring rod's black matches the block/piston color... ;)
 
I did that on purpose to confuse you.

I actually didn't even notice until you mentioned it. But once you said it, every time I scroll over the pictures, all I can see is a dial indicator going into the number one cylinder. Damn you lol


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I see you are running a geardrive , good . That helps . I would have run the crank thru a whole rotation . Reason being that what if the lobes are not symmetrical ? The ICL would be off .
Dead on with the TDC .
Your specs are different than my Crane . I have more lift and duration but you have about 10 degrees more ICL . I guess we'll see how it runs .

I didn't think about that. But if it wasn't symmetrical, I wouldn't even be able to use the icl to set the cam timing would I? Without sounding like I haven't degreed a cam since college (which I haven't), I'm not sure I would know how to find the icl on a non symmetrical cam. I would imagine that I would need a different spec to go off of? I will definitely run it by the cam supplier to make sure though.
 
I think you're safe but you never know . I can't see why someone would grind a nonsymmetrical cam for a 6.5 but it doesn't hurt to ask .That's why I mentioned rolling the crank over for the full readings .

With the 1.5 rockers , you have .412 lift . The 1.6 , .440 .

Mike Jones gets into the centering of the various cams , think it was on The Yellow Bullet or Speed Talk forums .
He should know as he builds all kinds of cams .
 
Back
Top