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Going mechanical with a Moose Omega Marine IP

I don't know about your wanting to change the rpm of the 1-2 shift, but you definitely need to firm it up and shorten the shift time. That slippage can not be good on the frictions and steels, the fluid and ultimately the transmission. Not tweaking the 1-2 shift will lead to transmission failure faster than a good firm, fast shift will, IMHO.
 
Gettin fun watching you cut time. About the 4wd launch & parastatic drag- I'm on board with everyone else. Engauge the front axle. Think about this- if your front axle can absorb 40% of the load, that is A LOT easier in your rear axle.

Hummers are full time 4wd, and a bunch of people have swapped transfer cases or altered them in an attempt to gain mpg and a little speed. I have found no one that has done it to one 1, then bought a second hummer and done the same. Rear differential damage and added wear to the rear axle is off set by the minimal amount of power loss- and once you are doing anything to limit power because of wheel spin, you need more rubber held to the ground. Flip the switch and try it.

Then for a real nice launch- watch what it does in low range. You'll feel like a drag car. WARNING- once you do that you'll start considering 4:10s...
 
low 4 is tough because the shift time. It would most likely fall off boost during the shift, and not to mention trying to keep the turbo loaded without alot of load on the engine. My BURB had 4.10's with the 6.5L, and I was never impressed with how it pulled in 4 low because of the above reasons.
 
You almost would have to manually launch it in 2nd gear, then still worry about running out of gearing at about 55 in 4Lo OD. Unless of course you reach down after the 3-4 shift and yank the beast into 2Hi at the same time downshifting to 3rd as it hits redline! Time for somebody riding shotgun to help shift!
 
THEFERMANATOR said:
The parasitic drag is worth it when you have to worry about losing traction and going sideways. Have you tried changing your shift timing yet? Post up your tune file, and I can download the BAUMANN software, and compare it to a GM 4L80E tune file to see what the shift timing looks like VS what GM runs. Or you can email it to me if you can't upload it. Might be a few days before I can look at it though, having hand surgery tommorrow sometime(waiting for the phone call to find out when).
Click to expand...
Ok, I'll try sending the file for you to look at, but I won't be able to until tonight. I'm not sure if you'll need their software to view it or not, though you should be able to download that from their site. If you feel like taking a look that would be cool, thanks.
 
Husker6.5 said:
I don't know about your wanting to change the rpm of the 1-2 shift, but you definitely need to firm it up and shorten the shift time. That slippage can not be good on the frictions and steels, the fluid and ultimately the transmission. Not tweaking the 1-2 shift will lead to transmission failure faster than a good firm, fast shift will, IMHO.
Click to expand...

I hear ya. I actually don't think it's slipping the gear that much, I think what I'm feeling the most is the torque converter flaring before it locks up. So far, the controller hasn't given any warnings that the transmission is slipping, so that's good. It compares the speed of the input shaft speed sensor to the speed of the output shaft speed sensor to see if it's slipping. It can also detect TC slippage because it can compare engine rpm to the input shaft speed sensor. I'm guessing it only analyzes that when converter clutch is locked up though as the controller has no idea what stall converter is in the trans. I know when I did the launch last night the 1-2 shift felt pretty unremarkable, so I was hoping to see what it did in the video playback. I can kind of see it, but of course that's when the sun threw glare on the cluster. It looks like RPM just hangs at about 3100-ish until the converter locks in 2nd. It also looks like the speedometer stayed accelerating about the same, so it doesn't seem REALLY bad, it just isn't ideal. I've never liked the way this transmission shifted. I had one of those piggyback B&M controllers on it before and with that in the harshest setting it still was just barely sporty. The same controller is in my dad's truck and it hits HARD. I replaced the valve body with one off Ebay that was supposed to have a bunch of updates and that didn't seem to help. So then when I had the trans rebuilt I had him install all of the Sonnax updates that he could and it's still unremarkable. I've just never taken the time to really diagnose it. That will come sometime, fairly soon now so I don't burn it up. I'm suspicious of the oil pump though.

Will L. said:
Gettin fun watching you cut time. About the 4wd launch & parastatic drag- I'm on board with everyone else. Engauge the front axle. Think about this- if your front axle can absorb 40% of the load, that is A LOT easier in your rear axle.

Hummers are full time 4wd, and a bunch of people have swapped transfer cases or altered them in an attempt to gain mpg and a little speed. I have found no one that has done it to one 1, then bought a second hummer and done the same. Rear differential damage and added wear to the rear axle is off set by the minimal amount of power loss- and once you are doing anything to limit power because of wheel spin, you need more rubber held to the ground. Flip the switch and try it.

Then for a real nice launch- watch what it does in low range. You'll feel like a drag car. WARNING- once you do that you'll start considering 4:10s...
Click to expand...

I'm glad you're enjoying watching me cut the time, I was really worrying that I was becoming a serious oversharer. I'm really excited about the progress I'm making and it's fun having you guys to share it with! I'm not sure about 4:11s....I've actually almost thought about going the other way because it just feels like 1st gear ends too soon. I've thought about trying a launch in 2nd gear, but I don't want to abuse the transmission that much. I will try a 4Hi launch and see what that feels like. In the first video I shared last night, that was me trying to settle on a boost and that initial howl from the tires was when I wasn't paying attention to the boost gauge and it was hitting 10psi - I'm sure if I was in 4Hi I could hold at least 10psi and that should give a really nice launch then. I'll give it a go and share the results.

Oh I also still don't have the 4Lo trigger hooked up to the trans controller yet, so I need to do that before I do any 4Lo playing.
 
THEFERMANATOR said:
The parasitic drag is worth it when you have to worry about losing traction and going sideways. Have you tried changing your shift timing yet? Post up your tune file, and I can download the BAUMANN software, and compare it to a GM 4L80E tune file to see what the shift timing looks like VS what GM runs. Or you can email it to me if you can't upload it. Might be a few days before I can look at it though, having hand surgery tommorrow sometime(waiting for the phone call to find out when).
Click to expand...
I just reread this and you said you would download the Baumann software, duh. Sorry to gloss over that.
 
Really that bad to load your suburbans turbo up? My 93 2500 was 4wd and I could get scratch in 1,2,&3- never 4th. Doing 4lo (open diff) I couldn't get full boost, but about 7lbs. I was pushing about 13 with it normally, but it was over fueled.

Also it had no thought on a it hitting 60 mph in low- haha. I don't think any of my 6.5 rigs could hit 50 in low. I was meaning a boosted launch up to about 35-40 just for fun, no shifting manual. Definatley don't hurt anything.

And over sharing doesn't happen until you have 4-5 un-responded posts is my theory. Please keep us up to date. When I over share- you all better speak up or I'll keep going...
 
Whenever I romped on mine in 4 low, it would slam against the limiter before it could shift. I downloaded there software, but I'm trying to figure it out as far as shift time goes. I don't see a shift timing adjustment, just pressure. I'll look some more and see what I can come up with. I have a friend with a BUICK that he's swapping a 4l80e into, so I was going to be helping him, this just helps me to get a jump on learning it.
 
THEFERMANATOR said:
Whenever I romped on mine in 4 low, it would slam against the limiter before it could shift. I downloaded there software, but I'm trying to figure it out as far as shift time goes. I don't see a shift timing adjustment, just pressure. I'll look some more and see what I can come up with. I have a friend with a BUICK that he's swapping a 4l80e into, so I was going to be helping him, this just helps me to get a jump on learning it.
Click to expand...
Yeah I noticed the same thing. I haven't called Baumann to find out more about shifting events yet because it seemed like it would be more helpful if I could send a datalog file to them for them to analyze along with any questions. If you do find something though let me know what you find! Thanks.
 
Husker6.5 said:
You almost would have to manually launch it in 2nd gear, then still worry about running out of gearing at about 55 in 4Lo OD. Unless of course you reach down after the 3-4 shift and yank the beast into 2Hi at the same time downshifting to 3rd as it hits redline! Time for somebody riding shotgun to help shift!
Click to expand...
And then a 3rd person following behind to pick up the pieces!:D
 
Husker6.5 said:
I don't know about your wanting to change the rpm of the 1-2 shift, but you definitely need to firm it up and shorten the shift time. That slippage can not be good on the frictions and steels, the fluid and ultimately the transmission. Not tweaking the 1-2 shift will lead to transmission failure faster than a good firm, fast shift will, IMHO.
Click to expand...
Party pooper
 
Ok, I just tried a 4wd boosted launch. I haven't had a chance to analyze, but it isn't a great video... I kind of derped it. You see, my intent was to do a 10psi boosted launch....when I was building boost before I could even pay attention that it had hit 10psi, the gauge had whipped past 20psi!! :eek: So first, my throttle foot backed off a little, then my hare brain said "oh wait that will be cool" and then I hit play and released the brake.....all in the span of about .00376 seconds. So I think I was around 20psi, but I can't say for absolutely sure and the video starts at the same time the tires chirp. YES, all 4 tires chirped! It also snapped my neck, holy cow! Now I'm not sure that 0-80 was any quicker because just looking at the video it seems slower from 70-80, but again, I haven't put a timer to it. Also it's 78 and very humid right now where it was 65 and not humid in the last video. That may have affected it, not sure. So here it is for you to see and enjoy. I'm going to go get some ice for my neck now...:shifty:

 
Best be carefull, I've got bent tie rods and sleeves to prove what a boosted launch can do. Theres areason I put solid adjusting sleeves with jamb nuts in mine when I redid the front end as well as braces.
 
THEFERMANATOR said:
Best be carefull, I've got bent tie rods and sleeves to prove what a boosted launch can do. Theres areason I put solid adjusting sleeves with jamb nuts in mine when I redid the front end as well as braces.
Click to expand...
Good caution, thanks. I knew you had problems, but I guess I didn't consider that I was starting to get in the danger zone.
 
Husker6.5 said:
No. Think about it, WMI doesn't displace oxygen in the intake charge, now does it?
Click to expand...
True, but it cools the charge post-turbo so it makes the air that's already in there more dense which crams more oxygen into the engine per intake valve opening. I feel like moisture pre-turbo wouldn't have the same effect. I could see it keeping temps down some due to the moisture being in the charge, but I don't feel like it would make the charge denser. It makes sense in my mind, I just can't explain it well (I'm sure it has nothing to do with the 3 hours of sleep I got last night....).
 
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