Still brake problems

[Stoney]

Ok so before I decide to shoot the truck and give it a proper burial...
..I've literally changed every part in the brake system except the a.b.s. box ..(which I've considered eliminating)..( because I hate anti-lock brakes)...
I've changed the hydroboost... The master cylinder... The brake hoses front and back... The calipers..the rotors..the rear drum brakes..the power steering pump.. the steering gear box... And this is the only vehicle I've ever owned where the steering gearbox was part of the brake system LOL..
So the problem...
My front brakes do not release all the way.. when I put the new calipers on I could grab the rotor and spin it very freely it would rotate probably six or seven times before it slowed down and stopped. We bled the brake lines. And then the rotors would barely turn by hand..you grab them and spun them and they'd maybe rotate one full turn if that and stop and it took a lot of muscle to make them spin that far..
For those who have been following this saga.... I've been having ongoing brake problems with this.. the only thought I can come up with is that when we changed the master cylinder ( guy that a friend knew did it ) we also did a bunch of other work on the truck that day including putting rear brakes on.. so after that day when the truck started giving me problems I automatically figured it was in the brakes.. is it possible that he didn't bleed the master cylinder properly and somehow got air in the ABS box and that is what's making my brakes not want to release all the way??
It's just a shot in the dark but I am straight out of ideas.. any other suggestions I am all ears

 

[ak diesel driver]

based on everything you have described I'd be checking the adjustment on the rod into the master cylinder. Oh and the front brakes shouldn't spin freely

 

[Stoney]

You mean the rod that comes out of the hydro boost?..

 

[Big T]

I’d be checking your calipers.

It’s not air in the ABS. Brakes would be spongy, not locked up. For whatever reason, your brake calipers are not releasing.

 

[Stoney]

Calipers are brand new..this makes 3rd set I've had to put on ..I think they are going bad from over heating due to not releasing.

 

[Stoney]

If I remember correctly when we put the hydroboost in..we had to take the rod out of the old one to put in the new one..that's the rod that comes out of the hydroboost and pushes into the master cylinder.... I would have to double check but I don't remember that being adjustable... I think that just kind of slid into place.

 

[MrMarty51]

On that truck that I diagnosed with brake problems and figured out it was the wrong master cylinder, I do know that the differences in the masters was the depth that the master cylinder fit into the booster. I do not remember if it set deeper into the booster or if it was shallower.
The parts house here had ordered in three master cylinders and they were all the same and wrong, finally, I called and got the only good parts counter person in the store. I told him the number on the box, He said that was correct, I then reminded Him that it was a hydroboost system, He then exclaimed, OH, the master You have been getting is for a vac boost system, he then got the proper master unit and all was fine after we got it installed and bled out.

 

[Stoney]

Do you remember if it was making the brakes drag??

 

[MrMarty51]

Not for sure, it seemed like He kept bleeding them because they had no real good stopping power.
Maybe a master from a vac unit might fix Your dragging brakes.

 

[Stoney]

We have a junk truck it's an HD... On that one there is a little spacer between the hydroboost and the master cylinder it's probably half an inch thick or so.. I could try putting that on my truck just the spacer I mean... Because I do know that when I put the master cylinder on you can only slide it on so far before it hits the rod coming out of the hydro boost.. which leaves a gap between the hydroboost and the master cylinder... Then you tighten down the nuts and it draws the two together tight... I had originally thought that was weird and that the rod pushing into the master cylinder would engage the master cylinder but stupid me figured parts store would know what they were selling..

 

[Stoney]

But I can get one off a vac unit very easily to at local junk yard.

 

[MrMarty51]

as for Me, I would try the spacer, might be just the ticket.
I do not think that when I installed that master onto the booster that there was a gap when the master came up against the rod. I believe it sat onto the boost unit without having to do any pushing or pulling the master down with the bolts.

 

[Stoney]

Ok gonna try it this morning..

 

[nobby]

Total long shot but you are confident that the calipers are free moving on the steering knuckle itself. Once in a while one of my calipers drag too much because they start to interfere with the knuckle because of built up rust etc.

Cheers
Nobby

 

[Will L.]

I agree 150%! Give them an inch they try and take 10 yards

We have a junk truck it's an HD... On that one there is a little spacer between the hydroboost and the master cylinder it's probably half an inch thick or so.. I could try putting that on my truck just the spacer I mean... Because I do know that when I put the master cylinder on you can only slide it on so far before it hits the rod coming out of the hydro boost.. which leaves a gap between the hydroboost and the master cylinder... Then you tighten down the nuts and it draws the two together tight... I had originally thought that was weird and that the rod pushing into the master cylinder would engage the master cylinder but stupid me figured parts store would know what they were selling..

Jack the front end up and jackstands. Try spinning wheels. If they dont spin, loosen the 2 nuts mounting master to booster. Then check if they spin. If so- that is the issue. Either requires the spacer ormore likely wrong master cylinder.

 

[Big T]

Rereading your post, gotta question if you’re suffering from OCD. Once the brakes have been bled and used, they will NEVER spin freely 5 to 7 rotations. You’re lucky to get one rotation as the pads do rest on the rotors. Time to just drive it.

 

[Stoney]

P.t.s.d. yes....o.c.d..no....example..from a dead stop on a flat parking lot. Since I bought the truck, I could put it in gear ,take foot off the brake and the truck would take off rolling and bring itself up to about 20 mph without touching the accelerator...
Now, since this problem started...,, Put truck in gear and have to push accelerator just to get it to move... And I don't mean just touch the accelerator I mean push it.. like your overpowering the brakes...when you're driving on flat land and take your foot off the accelerator it slows itself down and brings itself to a stop..it never did that before..the master cylinder gets smoking hot as do the brake lines...it keeps locking up calipers...I've put 3new sets of calipers on and within days there shot.. if I take them off and crack open the bleeders you cannot push them in all the way..
truck not working right kept me off the road all summer..now winter coming.. something's got to give...
I think what happened is when I replaced the master cylinder I ordered one for a 97..but from what I was told yesterday since the truck is a early 97 1 ton f-vin alot of parts are actually 96..and the master to a 96 is different.. which would have caused the bind up putting a 97 master against the hydroboost on a 96..so you would think that later when I changed the hydroboost it would have corrected the problem since the new master cylinder was 97 and the new hydroboost was a 97... But then I got thinking about that.. the one part you do not get when you buy a hydro boost.. you don't get the rod and retainer that pushes from the hydro booster to the master cylinder.. you have to use your old one.. so if my theory is correct, right now as it sets I have a 97 hydroboost and a 97 master cylinder with a 96 rod between them which is constantly keeping pressure on the master cylinder..I know it's keeping pressure on the master cylinder because when I put the master cylinder on I have to tighten the nuts down to draw the master cylinder in onto the hydro booster because the pushrod is pushing into it before it becomes flush...because I had never worked on one before I didn't know that it wasn't supposed to do that.. that rod is supposed to just barely touch the master cylinder when the brakes are not engaged... So back to the drawing board..thankfully everything I have bought has a warranty... So I went back to AutoZone and reordered a new hydro booster and new master cylinder new brake hoses new calipers new pads new rotors (since they're probably warped now) new bearings and new seals etc etc..but I ordered the hydro booster and master cylinder for a 96 not a 97 just so my push rod will be correct..thankfully the guys at AutoZone are going to just let me return the ones I bought before and use the money to buy the new ones...
Keeping my fingers crossed.

 

[MrMarty51]

And with the master cylinder piston depressed part ways in, that would keep the fluid frm returning back to the master cylinder for the front calipers.
One a them AH HA moments.

 

[Stoney]

Lol... Yeah one of those moments when you can finally quit beating your head on the concrete wall...I got to Buddy's going to hook up with me tonight to tear the whole truck apart and put all this new stuff in... So I'm praying to God that it works after this.. and that more importantly I can get on the road and try to bank up at least a little bit of money before the snow flies..which judging by the way the weather has been is not going to be very long...

 

[Big T]

P.t.s.d. yes....o.c.d..no....example..from a dead stop on a flat parking lot. Since I bought the truck, I could put it in gear ,take foot off the brake and the truck would take off rolling and bring itself up to about 20 mph without touching the accelerator...
Now, since this problem started...,, Put truck in gear and have to push accelerator just to get it to move... And I don't mean just touch the accelerator I mean push it.. like your overpowering the brakes...when you're driving on flat land and take your foot off the accelerator it slows itself down and brings itself to a stop..it never did that before..the master cylinder gets smoking hot as do the brake lines...it keeps locking up calipers...I've put 3new sets of calipers on and within days there shot.. if I take them off and crack open the bleeders you cannot push them in all the way..
truck not working right kept me off the road all summer..now winter coming.. something's got to give...
I think what happened is when I replaced the master cylinder I ordered one for a 97..but from what I was told yesterday since the truck is a early 97 1 ton f-vin alot of parts are actually 96..and the master to a 96 is different.. which would have caused the bind up putting a 97 master against the hydroboost on a 96..so you would think that later when I changed the hydroboost it would have corrected the problem since the new master cylinder was 97 and the new hydroboost was a 97... But then I got thinking about that.. the one part you do not get when you buy a hydro boost.. you don't get the rod and retainer that pushes from the hydro booster to the master cylinder.. you have to use your old one.. so if my theory is correct, right now as it sets I have a 97 hydroboost and a 97 master cylinder with a 96 rod between them which is constantly keeping pressure on the master cylinder..I know it's keeping pressure on the master cylinder because when I put the master cylinder on I have to tighten the nuts down to draw the master cylinder in onto the hydro booster because the pushrod is pushing into it before it becomes flush...because I had never worked on one before I didn't know that it wasn't supposed to do that.. that rod is supposed to just barely touch the master cylinder when the brakes are not engaged... So back to the drawing board..thankfully everything I have bought has a warranty... So I went back to AutoZone and reordered a new hydro booster and new master cylinder new brake hoses new calipers new pads new rotors (since they're probably warped now) new bearings and new seals etc etc..but I ordered the hydro booster and master cylinder for a 96 not a 97 just so my push rod will be correct..thankfully the guys at AutoZone are going to just let me return the ones I bought before and use the money to buy the new ones...
Keeping my fingers crossed.

Your problem is that you're buying parts from Autozone and the idiots there know nothing. Buy from RockAuto where the correct parts are already sorted on the site.