Running w/o CV axels

[Paveltolz]

Still can't get the CV joint separated from the axel...!@$_+%*&@. Hub, when separated from the CV spins as easily as the new one though so it may just be that front differential.

Once I get the CV joint separated and back in I'll be able to drive it to be sure but yeah, I think I'm on to something. Just thinking of all the wasted power and fuel over the years....

Education education education!

 

[3500GMC]

Paul IIRC, with boot slid away and cv at max angle, you remove one cir-clip, push the axle in past that groove to access the end-most cir-clip (its in a recess) which will enable you to extract the axle shaft. The innards may work their way out (on the truck) if you don't cap it off someway.

 

[Paveltolz]

Paul IIRC, with boot slid away and cv at max angle, you remove one cir-clip, push the axle in past that groove to access the end-most cir-clip (its in a recess) which will enable you to extract the axle shaft. The innards may work their way out (on the truck) if you don't cap it off someway.

Thanks. I must be working with just such a unit as the other side I was able to get at the cir-clip and open it up with a cheesy spreader (multi app tips) and the CV just fell off shaft. Only one cir-clip. That was the Rock Auto unit I put in a while back when I was swapping out bushings etc.

This one is fighting and fighting hard but I will try it your way and see what happens. Starting to get a bit irritated...whine moan complain.....

 

[3500GMC]

Its been a while since my CV exercise. Maybe I described the 3 roller (inner) end... I hope you get it and hopefully I didn't add to your confusion/grief.

 

[Paveltolz]

No worries, my memory isn't a shining example to...um...I forget.

Not sure why I didn't do this yesterday, must be the fact that I was narrowly focused on the CV joint separation from the axle, but, both of the hubs on the front differential spin freely and easily. Easier than the new bearing hubs do. Right now my money is on the old hubs and CV joints. Like I mentioned, to get them to rotate when assembled required the leverage of a breaker bar (or tire bolted up).
I'll drive it tomorrow and see if my thoughts are correct but I'm replacing the rotors and pads since I've got everything apart still. Might as well.

Rear brakes are next....

 

[Paveltolz]

Some days it isn't worth chewing through the leather straps!
Got the cv separated.
Rotors turned
New pads
Reassembled
Test roll down the hill to warm up motor, settle in new pads etc.
slowed for an upcoming stop sign.... Crunch bang grind!
Left hub dissintigrated!
Took the pads, rotor, caliper, and stripped out steering knuckle where calipers bolt in!
Yes the cv was bolted in (torqued to 133lbs).
O'Reilly will warranty about everything but the knuckle. Can that hole be helicoild?
It's only torqued to what 17 lbs?

 

[3500GMC]

Well shit.

Pretty sure threads are metric, coils are available in metric.. The caliper holes in the knuckle aren't blind IIRC, so I don't know if the coils would work properly..

Or a gently used parts yard knuckle..

 

[Paveltolz]

Gently Used...4x4...hope springs eternal.
Strip yard versions can be found locally for $30-$55.
The platinum plated titanium ones for sale at LMC are $719.95:yikes: Yup, Seven Hundred nineteen dollars and ninety-five cents U.S.
If it were a 1997 it would only be $250.
Cheaper to keep 'er they said....

 

[3500GMC]

Keep chewing through those leather straps (love that) is about the only other advice I can give..

 

[ak diesel driver]

what's that saying... if it wasn't for bad luck I'd have no luck at all. hang in there bro

 

[Burning oil]

Maybe weld it up solid then drill and tap to size? Not sure how tough the weld would be to drill/tap though.
Possible to weld a nut inplace?

 

[btfarm]

Get me a thread size for the bolt and length of thread. I may have a Keensert on hand.
That means you would have to have a much oversize metric tap though.
I have M10 (M16 tap), M16 (M22 tap), M8 (M12 tap)

 

[WarWagon]

what's that saying... if it wasn't for bad luck I'd have no luck at all. hang in there bro

Need that luck club. :suicide: O'Reilly has got to love us 6.5ers only warrantying parts 2-3 times for each purchase... :hihi: Well some parts anyway.

What kind of hubs were you running? O'Reilly appears to have China cheap or Korea expensive made hub bearings. Looks like it had an awful amount of resistance to turning.

 

[Paveltolz]

Luck. Half full glass opinion was that having it fail 300 feet from home was better than 300 miles or at 120mph on the salt.

Mike, thanks for the offer on the coil thread repair. The threads are 12mm 1.75 pitch. Figures. I have requested the sleeve version vs. the coiled spring although I think the spring version will work.

O'Reilly is warrantying most everything. I'm upgrading the rotors and replacing the calipers and hubs. Hub/bearing set is the Expensive China "Precision" units (Moog off brand) and everyone of the clerks are scratching their heads as they've not seen one come apart before. "The other ones we see often but not these." I'm thinking that the CV axel hung and didn't seat all the way against the back of the bearing sets. It even torqued down!

Side View


De-threaded


Spring?


"That's going to leave a mark!"


Caliper damaged but doesn't look un-servicable. Still, with the torque it took to twist up against the rotor and the weight it took. Replacement waiting at shop.

 

[Burning oil]

Is the bearing held on with 3 or 4 bolts on a 1500?

 

[Paveltolz]

Three bolts hold the bearing hub assembly to the steering knuckle.

O'Reilly replaced everything to include the rotors. Manager worked with me and upgraded what he could.
I got the right side pads and rotors on in no time and the driver's side took a couple of hours. I bled the system and took it for a drive. I hear the new pads and rotors working against each other while coasting though. Can't remember if this is normal as things seat?
Bosch Premium rotors and Carbon Metalic pads vs Ceramic or Semi-Metalic.

Ended up using Heli-Coil for the stripped out brake caliper bolt hole. It sure was a tight fit afterwards but I figured to heck with it. I picked up an extra steering knuckle for $26 and when the ball joints need replacing, I'll pick up the repair bolt for the caliper too. With the lift, it is just a matter of time.

Here's the steps if anyone is interested in trying this at home too.

While the brake paint was drying...

Drill it out.


Tap it with the provided bit.


I ran it all the way through as it was easier to work from the front.


Lock tight RED 275 to hold the coil. (The coil protruded from the back to I used a 4" cutoff wheel to trim it flush to the surface of the knuckle)



Hub in place with CV axle bolt tightened to 200nM (That's brake fluid, not 3n1 oil back there)


All together

 

[btfarm]

Looks good Paul! :thumbsup:

Of course it probably looked good before the carnage too...:hihi:

 

[Burning oil]

Are you running the CV outers only this time?
Any difference in drag now?

 

[Paveltolz]

Are you running the CV outers only this time?
Any difference in drag now?

Yes, just the CV outers are in the hubs now. They were before but, obviously now that I got it repaired, the left one wasn't fully seated. As for difference in the drag, that will have to wait a bit while the new rotors and pads adjust as they are audibly rubbing now. The rear brakes check out good. Enough on the shoes and the drums to last another 2 years according to the mechanic. Rear brakes are one of my 'learn to do myself' things. Until then, I'll continue to turn it over to my favorite mechanic (used to teach at the local university until deciding to work his own business).

I also pulled the front drive shaft yesterday and I'll run it this way for a while to see what the results are.

Tires are next and I hate to admit it, they are looking more and more to being the cause of the sluggishness and higher EGTs.

 

[great white]

Not saying this is your problem or if it will help, but I'll throw it out there for consideration.

My truck is a K2500 8 lug rims. Yours is a touch different with the 6 lug rims, so there may be some incremental differences in the following info.

My truck is many things, but it is not slow "out of the hole" and definitely not underpowered.

I recently swapped from the stock steel rims to a set of PY0 from a later 2500HD.

The difference in acceleration was very noticeable. I'm now accelerating (empty) with little more than 1000-1200 rpm and leaving traffic behind. They do not drive slow here. I now seldom need to dial in more than 2000 rpm for brisk acceleration where before I would have my foot planted much deeper to achieve the same rate of acceleration.

While the rims should not make a difference when up to speed, I notice I barely have to feather the throttle to maintain speed now. All I can attribute that to is the fact that less lb/ft are going in to the rotating mass and more is going to the tread/road interface.

My braking is improved. My suspension action is more compliant.

I weighed the steel wheels and the PY0's:

36 lbs for the stock steel rims (36x4=144lbs for 4 rims)
17 lbs for the PY0 rims (17x4= 68 lbs for 4 rims, that's a 76 lb savings!)

The tires are the same ones on each set of rims: BFG AT 265 75 15

The difference in my truck is just short of astounding.

I even believe I'm seeing better mpg on this tank judging by the odometer, but confirmation will have to wait until I can get a few tanks on it and do some calculations. I was up to 18 mpg (combined, 4:10) before the wheels, I would be more than pleased if I gain 1-2 mpg as a result of the lower rotating mass and would make the $200 I spent on the rims well worth the initial outlay.

As I mentioned: the stock steels may not be your issue with acceleration comparing it to a similar truck also wearing steels, but they sure are not helping. The PY0 rims aren't an option for 6 luggers, but there must be decent looking aftermarket rims that offer similar weight savings.


(next up: rear disc conversion to drop another 50 odd pounds off that full floating rear axle right at rotating those big heavy drums )