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Looking for a performance DB2

Well lots of interest and questions!

I too am hoping the pump will hold up for the long haul- so far I like. I did not realize how bad the old pump was!

I agree on the piston melting issue- I think 1200 is a safe guideline but a lot of other factors go into weather or not one melts a piston.

The pumps are the Baby Moose for stock/ mild builds, the 90cc Moose Junior for those mild/ warm motors, the 100cc Bull Moose(what I have) for somebody with more mods/ bigger turbo, and the Omega Moose which to my knowledge they have not built for a 6.2/ 6.5. It puts out 135cc is described as a recreational use only pump not for the street.

As to the smoke, let me re phrase my earlier statements. If you drive with restraint and an easy right feet you can eliminate/ limit the smoke. However should feel like a deviant teenager with a heavier right foot below about 1700-1800 rpms she will roll coal. I have left a solid cloud all the way from 2nd thru 4th, as I do not use 1st hardly ever. If the smoke was/ is an issue Conestoga discussed running an aneroid. Apparently this is popular with the Ferd crowd to limit fuel until the turbo spools. No sure completely how it works but I thought I might need one- so far since my foot controls the throttle and I am no longer a deviant teen hellbent on mayhem so I think I will be fine. After driving in traffic tonight I know I would fail an emissions test!

Took her for a spin into town(Louisa) and then Richmond tonight. She ran great- no more hot start issues, no more shutting down, in general a 100% improvement. She will definitely roll some coal- and on command if desired. It was harder to keep from smoking with faster pace of traffic, offline in 2nd was not to bad but the rpm drop on the shift (at 2000-2200) dropped you out of the turbos powerband and she would smoke until 1700-1800. With a more gentle and patient foot she would run smoke free. I like the setup, when I need fuel it is there. EGTS so far have not been an issue, even when rolling coal. The highest EGT I have seen is 800. Boost under normal acceleration runs from 3-8 psi and cruise at 60 2-3psi. I love the new found power, smoothness, and the new whistle, still getting used to the sound of the ATT whistling. I have 12,000 miles on this ATT on other trucks and it has never whistled until this pump. She also seems to run stronger than my chipped 6.5s with the same turbo. I know I need to upgrade the fuel pump to the Walbro and she will get even more fuel.

Fuel mileage: got fuel tonight and she got 20.2 mpg. That was 505 miles of which about 90 or so is with the new pump. This is the second time I have gotten fuel with this truck. The first 235 miles netted me 19.8 mpg. I love the way you can drive with a stick. Most of the time I shift at 1800 and she loves it. Boost will stay around 1 psi cruising until I get past 50. Hope this mileage will hold up!
 
Cool beans, 20 mpg, damn.

Did you have to send yours in? If so, did they replace the H@R?

How did you time it?

Maybe time for more boost. :thumbsup:
 
Sorry I forgot to answer the timing question. I just stuck the pump back on as close as could to where the old pump sat. I figured if my egts were wonky or the sound did not sound right I would adjust. My guess seems to be pretty good so far. That was/ is my temporary solution. We are taking this truck to NJ to visit family on Thanksgiving. Conestoga Diesel is on the way to New Jersey so when I was discussing timing the pump I mentioned this. They are going to time the truck for me for $50 on the way up to NJ. I also thought since all they mostly look it is Ferds they like to see a real truck!:D:rof:

With the auto DS4 trucks I was shifting in the 2000-2400 range usually. They never dropped below 1500 rpms. Little D with GMX, turbo master and chip was netting about 18.5-19 consistently. Larry with the ATT and a chip was 17.5-18 consistently. So I guess the lower rpms the manual allows are worth some fuel mileage points.

My point on the pump was it is a hot pump- ie it delivers a lot of fuel. They also told me the mess with the timing of the pump internally. Once the turbo fully lights (1800+) at heavy throttle (above 50%) she will pin you to the seat and pull like crazy. I also suspect with a smaller turbo and smaller precups(I am running diamond cups in these heads) the smoking would be worse. However I choose to mostly drive at 1/8-1/4 throttle for economy reasons, engine longevity, etc. That is why I usually shift in the 1800 range. Driving it this way the pump runs fine and is virtually smoke free. That was my point, that you can use and drive it on a daily basis and still get good economy and smooth running but have the fuel when you need it or want it.

I can gauge that acceleration this way. With the old pump I had my wife following me home with Gary, the NA 6.5. She was shifting around 2000-2200. I was shifting at 1800-2000. By the time I hit 60 she was a good half a mile to 3/4s of a mile behind me. Gary has 160-170 hp at the flywheel probably. I figure with the old pump 250 hp or so at the flywheel for T. The knew pump is quicker still. I do not need to wail the gas pedal to the carpet 24/7. I do enjoy some spirited driving on occasion on a lonely backroad and rolling coal is fun but I like to set my trucks/ vehicles up so they run strong at part throttle and you do not have to beat on them unless you need to. It is nice to have some power when you have 6000 lbs behind you and you need to pull out into traffic. It is fun to drop down a gear on a long straight stretch and let her run. I want my trucks to last and deliver decent economy so I try to keep the right foot in line- for the most part!:D

I will post updates and keep track of the fuel economy. If she holds around 20mpg I will be pretty happy- it is a 3/4 ton 4x4 after all!
 
Thanks for the very detailed posts on the behavior/characteristics of your new Moose Pump. :thumbsup: I certainly know what upgrade I'll be saving up for next. Thanks

Matt
 
Yesterday was the first "cold" morning with new Moose pump. It was 34 degrees here. It started great, with no drama (no noisy rattle, no coughing, hacking, etc). It started like it was 60 degrees outside, no smoke just a smooth even idle. Still supper pleased with the running- have put another 140+/- miles on it. The weight of my shoe on the throttle is enough to maintain speed. I am still surprised at the smoothness and throttle response- far superior to any of the DS4 trucks I have driven, owned, and or modified.
 
Chevypoor said:
We are taking this truck to NJ to visit family on Thanksgiving. Conestoga Diesel is on the way to New Jersey so when I was discussing timing the pump I mentioned this. They are going to time the truck for me for $50 on the way up to NJ. I also thought since all they mostly look it is Ferds they like to see a real truck!:D:rof:
Click to expand...

:sifone: While you are there it would be extremely useful for me and them if you asked them to measure and make sure the smoke puff limiter will clear everything on a 6.5. Including the full timing range. I suspect it may be pretty close to the upper intake. With emissions requirements here and not wanting to waste fuel via smoke it is almost required to have one.
 
WarWagon said:
:sifone: While you are there it would be extremely useful for me and them if you asked them to measure and make sure the smoke puff limiter will clear everything on a 6.5. Including the full timing range. I suspect it may be pretty close to the upper intake. With emissions requirements here and not wanting to waste fuel via smoke it is almost required to have one.
Click to expand...

I will ask them for more info when I go on both the aneroid and the puff limiter. After 250+ miles of driving on the new pump it does smoke if you are not careful with the throttle when you shift until the rpms come back up.
 
WarWagon said:
:sifone: While you are there it would be extremely useful for me and them if you asked them to measure and make sure the smoke puff limiter will clear everything on a 6.5. Including the full timing range. I suspect it may be pretty close to the upper intake. With emissions requirements here and not wanting to waste fuel via smoke it is almost required to have one.
Click to expand...

I will ask them for more info when I go on both the aneroid and the puff limiter. After 250+ miles of driving on the new pump it does smoke if you are not careful with the throttle when you shift until the rpms come back up.
 
Ah.. I see! I feel like the :lame: kid that does not know all the cool slang. :dupe:

Thanks for schoolin me!:)
 
Have you done any wide open runs? Any idea on what kind of boost you run at full throttle with the att?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
3500_6.5 said:
Have you done any wide open runs? Any idea on what kind of boost you run at full throttle with the att?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

So far I have not done any extended wide open throttle runs, I have however gotten close a couple of times. I have seen almost 14psi with the ATT and about 850 on the egts. Most of my drives have been to town or just for fun with my wife. I have been a little hesitant to really hammer on her hard for an extended period since I am fighting some cooling issues- I think the high flow balanced flow wp may be a bit much. I keep blowing t-stat gaskets. It also seems to harder to purge the air in this truck. This is my first experience with a non surge tank trunk. She runs under 210 but on the interstate she gets close. I have changed the rad cap and that helped. No bubbles in the coolant so I feel confidant the new head gaskets are ok. I am planning on swapping to the newer surge tank setup as it seems to allow the cooling system to "breathe" better on my 95s. I am also waiting on getting the Moose pump timed. I suspect it may be a bit advanced as my egts and boost are also up a bit at interstate speeds (70-75). 65 and below seems fine.
 
WarWagon said:
Low boost and low EGT read advanced to me. That or you are starving the IP for fuel.
http://www.oliverdiesel.com/tech/timing.htm
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link. I do think the Walbro would help- I noticed a nice difference on the DS4 from getting plenty of fuel. The Walbro that Leroy sells is on the list.:D

Not sure on the timing as it runs great, there is just a difference in boost once you pass 65. At 60 I am turning 1850 or so in 5th and I am at around 3psi of boost and 450-500 egts. At 70 I am at 2200rpms and 4psi-5psi and 600-650 on the egts. Seems like a jump to me. This turbo on the 4l80e 4x4 with a DS4 and 4.10s was at 550-600 and 3.5psi at 70 which was 2400rpms. I have 3.73s in T. At 50 mph in T I am 1600 or so and 400-450 egts and 2-2.5 psi. I just want to make sure everything is in order before I wail on it to much- last time I took a 275k motor with unknown history and I flogged it hard I spun three main bearings and damn near locked it up!
 
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