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6.5 Chevy Cheyenne 3500 Stalling and No-start

JamesKing1995TurboDiesel6

JamesKing1995TurboDiesel6

Member
Messages
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Location
TEXOMA
Hey Gang! I've read so many of these but never pisted. Ive hoped to find a solution to my issue on 1995 Chevy Cheyenne 3500, but every situation was slightly different so Im finally taking the plunge. Im a fair mechanic and very good with fixing stuff so I think together, we will do awesome at helping me once and for all!

===================================

Truck Background:
90k miles
All stock
PMD Relocation Done (bumper location)
Lift pymp done by dumbbells and cut orig lines. I redid them using gas line and 2 clamps per connection.

Also... the blue wire for the lift seemd to have broke somewhereso they also tokk a damn speaker wite and ran to the fuse box. It does come on with key, but stays on the whole time. Not sure if that is ok.

===================================

New parts all are less than a week old and are as follows...
1. PMD
2. Alternator
3. Batteries
4. Fuel filter
5. Lift pump
6. Intake sensor (top of intake location)
7. Glow plug Relay
8. Air filter
9. I also replaced a break part non valueable fir my issue im sure but in transparency its now added LOL
I think thats it?
___________________________________

After reset these are the freshest codes i have...

1. #14 (Engine coolant temp. sensor)
2. #31 (EGR control pressure)
3. #42 (Fuel temp. Circuit low)
4. #57 (PCM 5-VOLT short)
5. #62 (Turbo Charger boost censor High)

===================================
Issue(s) and time line...

Truck has been great. Always started and ran although it always had PMD issues.. revving up, very little stalling but it has a bit, and as far as i know nothin major.

After 5 yrs owning and most of the time sitting like a good work truck ready for a job I had to start using as a primary vehicle about a year agi. Thats when all hell broke loose. Ive spent hours of time rwading, begging, searching mechanics and replacing stuff. Heres why...

Truck last year stalls.. and stalls.. and stalls.. buy 2 (3 year warrenty) Walmart batteries for this exact application. Batteries die so fast! And charge, and charge... over and over.... Return batteries... 2 new ones same store... one year batteries this time... Same issue. Batteries seem weak.. drain fast, and didnt last long. Tested them. 2v to each cell. Charge up fine... so im stilk using them . The batteries are all less than one year old. But i only crank 3 times for like 10 sec. Each time and i have to recharge batteries AGAIN.

STALLING...

Truck starts to stall more and more as i drive it... Been stranded 14 times this summer and many times last winter. Fig out last winter to jump the Glow Relay (easy fast fix) and it started right back up.

THIS MONTH...

Finally, the truck is not trustworthy, not drivable and im so confused. When the glow light comes on now, its short and not the typical 5 to 10 seconds as always has been. I cant stress that enough. Ive read 300 posts where a guy is adding this as an issue and others say... " well thats no issue... it will...with climate blah blah..." NO! THIS is a major issue in my situation specifically. I believe may be the root cause of the other (stalling) issue as well but i cant be sure.

Every so often, i eill get a 10 sec light to stay on and I always say ouy loud... "Bet she fires up no prob now..." AND EVERY TIME IT FIRES AND RUNS.

This glow plug light is timed by a sensor i guess? Maybe also ECM? This brings me to another clue.

Flush and fill...

I did a bad thing. I flyshed and only used water. I live in Texas and it was only two months ago so not a chance this summer that it was to cold or froze and i have NOT over heated the truck as it just doesnt run. The flush was just my attempt at a cheap possible fix.

I think now all the sudden im leaking out of my damg water pump so i may need that replaced now too...

Noticed water without Anti freeze makes pretty orange rust in the system so i wilk fill properly once the truck runs and i replace pump if its indeed shot.

===================================

Ive heard and read of a timer for the glow plug light and connected parts but seen no proof of this. My idea is that this light is directly controlled by the brain and thats that. I'm actually starting to suspect that the brain (ECM?) may be my issue. Again i just dont know.

Truck runs great WHEN IT STARTS. BUT... While driving, the truck does this...

1. Stalls as if the key were turned off
2. Hard starts
3. Sometimes Rev up by its self
(This is why i replaced the PMD THIS WEEK. I BOUGHT 2 NEW ONES.. YES 2) LOL
4. F@ST cycling glow plug light
5. Hard on batteries and/ or the Walmart brand batteries are truely a rip off. I get that most eill agree with that but... This truck ALWAYS starts if that plug light stays lit properly so im ruling out dead batteries for goid! Ive done started this truck with the origonal batteries from purchase with 3 bad cells before and i know it will start even with a weak battery.

I aldo know that weak batteries can be a very trucky hidden p.i.t.a. so i never say never...

Thats why i bought 2 new ones just so we can skip the guy who is definitely going to chime in the thread and say... DID YA CHEC FRESH BATTERIES? SOME TIMES..."

The brand new PMD BOXES will hopefully rule out the guy who will definitely be chiming in with... " Brother, you need to replace and relocate that PMD man... Im tellin ya... trust me..."

I want to even see if we can skip the giy who will say... "Guy, that glow light thingy...it dont matter.. as long as you have...."


All 3 are a major time killer here. I need to figure out how to get my light to stay on. As ive said, its not the Plug Solinoid or as also called GLOW plug Relay. My old one is good. But i replaced with brand new one yesterday just to eliminate that giys advice too..

Now we have all the data i can provide...

I started it by pull start last week. Heres what i got... Black smoke. I usually dont see that cobbing mess out of my pipes EVER. Its so thin i barely notice usually. This was noticable. Not out of control, but just more than usual. So that may be another clue or maybe just burning out all the gass from so many no starts and trying to pull start it for about 10 miles? I only drove it home and that was a mile that day. Last week that is... i parked it and i let it run. It sounded so sexy. Just clug clug clug... no hesitation no bumps.. just pure lapping.

Then i shut it off.. restarted just like new... shut off.. restarted hour later just like new...

Next day... DOA

NO start.. batteries dead.. back to charging and putting in more cell acid... Im wore out yall. I need help. This is my only truck..only transportation. Im all by myself after a bad divorce and im now 1600 miles from my home town. I live here permanently so that wont change but i have no one to call for rides. I have , HAVE to fig this out.

Please can anyone feel me on that and give me some advice?

Thanks gang! I love you dudes! Even the few Battery, PMD, and Relay guys! Haha, yall are right in some threads... just maybe not this ine.

Take care
 
Ok, possibly more than one issue here.
Gonna jump to the black smoke. If that was a one time thing, or only happens after a no start issue- don’t sweat it. If it happens often it can be something worth dealing with, so you need to clarify that. Either way- move it to last on the list AFTER you verify we are not dealing with a plugged or collapsed air filter, animal nest int the intake plenum, etc. So no $ to spend just verify clear airflow.


The Grounds. Remove battery cables, clean the ends. Then the ground wires on the engine- negative battery cable, and the harness n the engine- especially the grounds back by the transmission on passenger side. Could be someone moved them, we already know soem electrical has been messed with by some one not doing everything right. You must remove and clean the rings and the bolt they go to.
Spend an hour just following the harness and make sure they are all clean.
Write a list of everything you see that is questionable in the electric system- pictures help a lot.

Not always thrown in there but in your case we are fighting a couple issues, so consider dropping the positive bates cable off starter for cleaning and inspection. Look over the starter solenoid for cracks/ damage.

Once all that is back together except the battery ground cable (always last to go back on anyways), you need a multi meter for testing amperage. I hate the harbor freight $5 meter- but if your broke it is ok for this use- NEVER use it on house power even though it says it is rated for it- they are not trustworthy and can kill you. Hopefully you already own a good meter. Search YouTube or bitchute for “parasitic draw test”. Watch a few different ones because some people miss a step- like open doors etc. I can explain steps of testing but watching a video is probably better.

Solve the electrical draw problem first, it might be the cause of the hard starts.
Incase you find it is something unrelated - next deal with hard start.

Putting in a set of ac delco 60g is not recommended until you have bench tested the old ones to verify they are bad. Use your battery charger with glow plug to see they get red hot in. Couple seconds. Always put antisieze in threads when reinstalling.
You have other things to test for the hard start- fuel system, but because you mentioned glow light time, i want to throw this out here first and keep in electrical system.

Doing all this will take a few hours, respond back with findings, and we can cover the fuel system next.

Handling one step at a time will be crucial here.
 
Welcome to TTS! there's lots of people here to help. I agree with Will, check your grounds. loose or missing grounds to the PCM can cause some weird stuff. look on the engine where the trans dipstick is mounted near the rear of the intake, you should see three wires attached to ring terminals on the block. also in my case double check check all your fuses in both boxes. use a test light and make sure none are loose in their socket. I had an intermittent problem that turned out to be a worn out pin in the fuse box.

though it's not related to your issues... while your under there checking the starter for connections issues, make sure you have that little bracket connected at the rear of the starter. that little piece of steel can cause you lots of grief (breaking the block) if it's not there and secure.

It does sound like you have multiple issues going on here, it's best to tackle one at a time. Follow Will's advice, he knows theses trucks inside and out and has been there, done that!

you may also want to clear any codes on your PCM after you get all the grounds squared away and see what comes back.
 
dbrannon79 said:
An old wise mechanic once told me that I could use a small wrench and hold it to the field of an alternator when engine was off.. if it stick like a magnet then the regulator was stuck!
Click to expand...
YUP. I’m not sure about that theory but I have seen the cut out side of a regulator fail and then the alternator draws down duh battery(s).
Have to do a draw check then disconnect wires from the alternator and then do a recheck. If parasitic draw discontinues then the regulator is sticking closed.
 
the easiest way I know to check for a draw is to have everything off in the truck, doors closed, and nothing plugged into the cig lighter socket... disconnect the negative battery cables. then connect a test light in between the negative post on the batt and the negative cable. when it lights up bright then start unplugging things until the lights goes out or gets very dimm. start with the alternator wires.

on some vehicles the test light will always glow dimm because of the PCM using some power and also depending on your stereo system. usually I start with disconnecting the alternator then the radio / amp if installed. after that I start pulling fuses one by one watching the test light. just remember opening the door will cause the test light to go bright. so if messing with the inside fuse box, close the door each time to check.

just FYI yo have to use a test light with a regular bulb not an LED or digital one!
 
There are more than 1 issue, when I read it.
The GPs are controlled by ECT (Engine Coolant Temp Sensor)? It looks like there is ECT code.
Try fixing that code first.

Next, the Oil Pressure Sensor controls the LP unless it is modified.
So, if OPS is bad, then LP will not run when engine catches.

For sensors and sender, you need to buy ACDelco.
That includes ECT, OPS, CPS, Glow Plug controllers, Turbo Solenoid.

Then, there is the PMD.
How is the PMD mounted, does it have extension wire.
If so, extension can be bad.
Is the PMD on a heatsink, make sure it is OUTSIDE the hood (bumper or front of radiator).
etc.

Load test the batteries (needs 2 good batteries) NOT voltage test.

etc.
 
Will L. said:
Ok, possibly more than one issue here.
Gonna jump to the black smoke. If that was a one time thing, or only happens after a no start issue- don’t sweat it. If it happens often it can be something worth dealing with, so you need to clarify that. Either way- move it to last on the list AFTER you verify we are not dealing with a plugged or collapsed air filter, animal nest int the intake plenum, etc. So no $ to spend just verify clear airflow.


The Grounds. Remove battery cables, clean the ends. Then the ground wires on the engine- negative battery cable, and the harness n the engine- especially the grounds back by the transmission on passenger side. Could be someone moved them, we already know soem electrical has been messed with by some one not doing everything right. You must remove and clean the rings and the bolt they go to.
Spend an hour just following the harness and make sure they are all clean.
Write a list of everything you see that is questionable in the electric system- pictures help a lot.

Not always thrown in there but in your case we are fighting a couple issues, so consider dropping the positive bates cable off starter for cleaning and inspection. Look over the starter solenoid for cracks/ damage.

Once all that is back together except the battery ground cable (always last to go back on anyways), you need a multi meter for testing amperage. I hate the harbor freight $5 meter- but if your broke it is ok for this use- NEVER use it on house power even though it says it is rated for it- they are not trustworthy and can kill you. Hopefully you already own a good meter. Search YouTube or bitchute for “parasitic draw test”. Watch a few different ones because some people miss a step- like open doors etc. I can explain steps of testing but watching a video is probably better.

Solve the electrical draw problem first, it might be the cause of the hard starts.
Incase you find it is something unrelated - next deal with hard start.

Putting in a set of ac delco 60g is not recommended until you have bench tested the old ones to verify they are bad. Use your battery charger with glow plug to see they get red hot in. Couple seconds. Always put antisieze in threads when reinstalling.
You have other things to test for the hard start- fuel system, but because you mentioned glow light time, i want to throw this out here first and keep in electrical system.

Doing all this will take a few hours, respond back with findings, and we can cover the fuel system next.

Handling one step at a time will be crucial here.
Click to expand...
I like ypur style. I hate your suggestion because I knew it was coming. Electrical is not fun. Ill be under the pit of grounds then today so Ill be in touch and ill do my best to snap a pic if i see any issues as i go. I will add... Ground may just be it. I forgot a short lived issue amd think its a clue here. I had a week where the system was kicking power at 14v and then woudl go to 12v. It was like at each left turn i made the alternator would come on and power me but then kick off again. I just put this new alternator on and it seems to have cured my issue so i am just adding this for evidence purposes.

Is there a ground check list by chance available anywhere so I dint miss any? I know the main ones mostly but theres always a hidden gem somewhere in my experience. Thanks my friend in advance for tryin to solve this. Cant wait to tattle on the culprit.
 
dbrannon79 said:
Welcome to TTS! there's lots of people here to help. I agree with Will, check your grounds. loose or missing grounds to the PCM can cause some weird stuff. look on the engine where the trans dipstick is mounted near the rear of the intake, you should see three wires attached to ring terminals on the block. also in my case double check check all your fuses in both boxes. use a test light and make sure none are loose in their socket. I had an intermittent problem that turned out to be a worn out pin in the fuse box.

though it's not related to your issues... while your under there checking the starter for connections issues, make sure you have that little bracket connected at the rear of the starter. that little piece of steel can cause you lots of grief (breaking the block) if it's not there and secure.

It does sound like you have multiple issues going on here, it's best to tackle one at a time. Follow Will's advice, he knows theses trucks inside and out and has been there, done that!

you may also want to clear any codes on your PCM after you get all the grounds squared away and see what comes back.
Click to expand...
Ok yes im so glad yall answered. I can see were off to the exact start I was hoping for. Skipping the obvious parts changing is crucial at this dispensation of time for me. Thank you for this input. I may start a video log. It would be cool to have the ground process uploaded to our utube spot for guys to just follow along. I have bad service so ill see if i can even go there but i will at least snap pics where i can.

I had a mechanic calling me today but Im going to tell him I already found SOME LOL.

OFF TO BRUSH MY TEETH AND LAY IN THE GRAVEL A BIT.. (GROWL)
 
Add the manual trans into your description.
The more you have that updated, the better.

Grew up laying on gravel. Get a refrigerator cardboard box. Also the creeper rolling pads work good. Diy version once you watch a video if $ is tight.
 
MrMarty51 said:
Check the alternator output.
Click to expand...
Yes sir. I installed a digital read and set it on my dash. Its at 13.7 to 14 if i remember running down the road. I only got 3 days on new alt b4 it died last time and just wont stay running. It just runs a few then stalls usually. Now though it barely starts. Strange that the last time i was towed by a buddy, it would not start for miles and miles. I kep poppin the clutch in third but no. I even rode it a bit to warm the cyl up but nah... right before we got to my home.. maybe a mile out, she popped off and for some reason that day ran like new no stalling. This to me points to ground maybe as the boys are mentioning. If there is a bad ground or two. It makes sense that they should move during a tow especially the jearking the truck obviously goes through in the process. The moving would make my loose ground appear to do EXACTLY what were experiencing.. (on - offs.) It would also explain the issue where it progressively got worse perhaps? Although We know that can also be sudden if the wires just broke. I assume higher guage wires don't do that but slowly - thread by thread - go bad with movement.
 
JMJNet said:
There are more than 1 issue, when I read it.
The GPs are controlled by ECT (Engine Coolant Temp Sensor)? It looks like there is ECT code.
Try fixing that code first.

Next, the Oil Pressure Sensor controls the LP unless it is modified.
So, if OPS is bad, then LP will not run when engine catches.

For sensors and sender, you need to buy ACDelco.
That includes ECT, OPS, CPS, Glow Plug controllers, Turbo Solenoid.

Then, there is the PMD.
How is the PMD mounted, does it have extension wire.
If so, extension can be bad.
Is the PMD on a heatsink, make sure it is OUTSIDE the hood (bumper or front of radiator).
etc.

Load test the batteries (needs 2 good batteries) NOT voltage test.

etc.
Click to expand...
PMD has a extended harness aftermarket i installed and a very nice aluminum finn block on it. Its also less than 2 miles old.
 
dbrannon79 said:
the easiest way I know to check for a draw is to have everything off in the truck, doors closed, and nothing plugged into the cig lighter socket... disconnect the negative battery cables. then connect a test light in between the negative post on the batt and the negative cable. when it lights up bright then start unplugging things until the lights goes out or gets very dimm. start with the alternator wires.

on some vehicles the test light will always glow dimm because of the PCM using some power and also depending on your stereo system. usually I start with disconnecting the alternator then the radio / amp if installed. after that I start pulling fuses one by one watching the test light. just remember opening the door will cause the test light to go bright. so if messing with the inside fuse box, close the door each time to check.

just FYI yo have to use a test light with a regular bulb not an LED or digital one!
Click to expand...


I have several incandescent bulb kinds yes sir. Im gonna start with the fuses. Ill take em alk out and sliggtly bend eack contact as welk as pentitrate each one a few times to rub contacts together so we know we have good solid contact. Ill also be checking the fuses both ways... plugged in at top as well as unplugged at the feet. Then I'll start this ground chase. I kinda think its a ground but you never know.ill do the par drain last. Ive trickle charged these new batteries i got in 3-21 and have fulk charge. Im leaving dual touch up chargers on as i go to combat any possible par drain as im working so we can at least keep that gremlin from bugging us as we do steps 1 & 2. I just topped of the battery fluids so good there
 
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