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6.5 Burb suburban diesel or Duraburb?

Crankme69

Crankme69

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Anyone here have any experience with them duraburbs out of Florida?

I would love to hook me up with a diesel burb someday, but one with a duramax :thumbsup: well now that would be like having my cake & eating it too...:hihi:

I did a little searching but not really sure about all the duraburb stats. I know there is some company doing conversions out in California that wants like $85K for a one, that ain't never gonna happen here on my budget.

Then also there is limited info on a duraburb company in Florida...from what I found appears to sell them in the $30K range? I am not sure if you have to supply them the vehicle or if that is for the whole enchilada?

I have also been looking at the Ford Excursions...but no way I would consider one unless it was 2003 or older with a 7.3. The Excursion maybe the best economical solution available presently, but I know so very little about the quirks that come along with the newer 7.3's...? My main concern is the cost of parts but they should be comparable to the Dmax for the injectors & such...I would think?

Administrators...I realize this subject may not be specifically 6.5 related, but diesel suburbans were only produced with the 6.5 or older 6.2 in em... so here is where I posted it :skep:
 
Perhaps a Duramax van would fit your needs.

It is a arena all of it's own when you get a 1 off vehicle or low production hot rod. You have to know how to fix it yourself or pay out the butt and still not get it 'fixed'. Not a lot of knowledge out there when you run into a problem with your 1 off vehicle. (I refer to the strange interactions not ordinary problems like a rod through the block that is plan as day to diagnose and fix.)

You can also run the numbers over a gas guzzler and see if the extra MPG makes sense with the higher cost of Diesel and Diesel repairs and upkeep.
 
Eric at DURABURB charges anywhere from $5,000-6,500 I believe depending upon which package you want. This price is simply to do the swap though as he says he has close to 100 man hours in a complete swap(which is very easy to do if you get very detailed about it). You supply him the BURB to get swapped, and either he buys you a donor or you supply one to him. I know his business has just about gobbled up all of the DURAMAX wrecks around here though as that is one reason why I had to pay so much for my dodnor truck(Eric had already called him and wanted it BAD). As for teh EXCURSIONS, they have there own set of quirks, but the biggies lie in the suspension if you want a 4X4.
 
I would take a P400 over a 6.6L anyway! No conversion required. Or just a new GEP engine in general with new GEP heads. If high performance is necessary then member 635, Ted, cam tell you a little bit about how well the extrude honing of the heads and exhaust manifolds imporves performance, but thats like $2500 to just hone the heads and manifolds. Alternately Peninsular sells new ported GEP heads and can install roller rockers in them for about $2500 including the heads. The roller rockers having a slightly higher ratio and less deflection for greater duration and lift.
 
When we were looking for a new Suburban we test drove an Excursion. There were several things we didn't like about it. But I really can't remember what. This was in 99 I believe.
 
I think I can give you alot of info here as I have come very close to buying an Excursion and have owned Powerstrokes...
1st Off, you are correct..Stay AWAY from 6.0s. There is a vaild reason older Excs with 7.3s sell for more than the newer 6.0s. without offending 6.0 owners let's just say be prepared to do alot of work and spend alot of money...
Hmmm....How shal I break this down...Maybe by topic...
Suspension
Burb..Way better. Smooter, rides nice. An Excursion is an F-350 with an SUV body and it rides like it. If you plan to tow real heavy though the Excursion is better. Not that Heavy a Burb is fine. There is nothing wrong with Ford suspension other than it rides like a straight axles truck. It's 10x stronger than GM IFS but you pay for that in ride comfort. Really just two differnt animals not which is better but more which is better suited to your needs.
Engine
A powerstroke is a much better engine than a 6.5TD. 6.5ers can argue all they want but a 6.5 is a light duty diesel, a Powerstroke is not. It can provide much ore available horsepower and it much stronger. It's a real good engine. The cons is when it breaks, it breaks expensive. You think Dmax injs are expensive ?? Powerstroke injs will run you about 3500-5K for a set vs 300$ for a 6.5TD. a 6.5TD is way easier to work on. I would NOT want to do HG's on a 7.3 althogh they are not really know for issues with them. They have some issues with the high pressure Oil pump which operates the Injs. Never had to fix one but didn't look horrible from what I read. For towing a 6.5TD will be on the side of the road with steam coming out of while a 7.3 cruises by not even breaking a sweat...for those who wish to dispute that..see my photo album. I have owned BOTH. My Fathers 7.3 towed my camper on a 100deg day without effort and the temp guage never moved. That same camper could overheat ANY of my 6.5s with ease and even my Cummins ran the high side of safe under the same circumstances. In fact other than a Dmax(which I have NO experience with) the Powerstroke 7.3 out tows any other diesel I have ever owned.
It blew any of my 6.5s away and blew away my second gen 24v cummins.
Cost.
7.3 equipped Excusrions are WAYYYY overpriced. On average they sell for 5-10k OVER Book. You wreck it and the ins aint gonna give you squat..bear that in mind. They are extremely coveted and lets face facts, there is NO SUV that can compare to an Excusrion in strength. Plain and simple. Anyone who disputes that is in fairy land. The thing is a brute.
However a 6.5 TD Burb can be bought for under 5k in decent condition. Hell, I paid 2k for mine with 94k on it. Deals on 6.5TD burbs are out there. No deals on 7.3 EXcs.
Drivabilty...
Who's gonna drive it ? aside from the ride a Burb is way easier to drive and manuver. If the Mrs. is gonna be the primary driver and she aint the kind who kick starts her vibrator and rolls her own tampons...she aint gonna like driving it and expect many parking lot "mishaps". I let my wife test drive one...she hated it. Loves her Pilot but doesn't mind the Burb. That is probably the sole reason she is not driving an Excursion. She has even said if the Pilot dies and we can't afford something else for awhile she was ok with the Burb..
Peformance...
who ya kidding ??
Even Bill Heaths Bonneville with all the work he did could be achieved on a 7.3 with a tuner on probably stage 2 and some minor upgrades.
So in the end it's really more of what you want and what you need. Both are fine for what they are as long as you know what you want.
As far as a Duraburb..Not a chance for my. Ferm is a guy who did his own conversion and can obvioulsy work on and understand what he has. You go spending big bucks on a Frankenstien like that , who's gonna work on it ? Buddy is right, just go the GEP route. A Duraburb is a nice idea but you need to be able to work on it and also understand, most people would not pay anywhere near what you will. I would not buy something that has been modified like that ? Suppose you crash it ? What do you think your ins co will total it out at ? Nowhere near what you paid for it for sure...
Hope this helps.
 
Also something to consider on the Duraburb...This co out of Fl converting them ...are they reegistered with the EPA ? In other words undertsand that all states differ i n requirements for emissions testing. Ferms Burb would not pass a ct emissions test regardless of what's coming out the tailpipe because here in Commyneticut they hook to the OBD2 port and on a 9x whatever Burb the computer will read the year and vin of whatever donor truck the Dmax came out of correct ? They would not proceed any further . It is against federal epa regs to modify a vehichles fuel or emissions system which a Dmax conversion is doing. Of course on old stuff that is exepmt from testing or in states where there is none or states like NY where you can grease the guy it doesn't matter but know your states regs first. Alot of guys with 6.0 fords are doing 12v conversions. A Gasser Excursion can be had for next to nothing. They are completly worthless. You could buy one of those and drop a 12v in way cheaper than a 99+ Exc with a 7.3(save for a wrung out hag) but you'll never get a sticker on it around here.
 
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Thanks for sharing, much appreciated. I am a GM guy, but I have owned one 90 7.3 INI NA diesel that just impressed the hell out of me. It was totally reliable other then the fact that it was surrounded by the Ford & I also was not impressed at all with the Ford OD auto trans that was bolted to it.

Fact or fiction on the newer 7.3 PS...? Can the injectors / glow plugs be changed without pulling the cab off the frame?
 
AFAIK Yes. The 6.0s can supposedly even be done but Ford's procedure is to remove the cab which on an Excursion would be nuts. Also you are correct. A topic I didn't tuoch on...
Tannys.
Ford Tranny suck, period. The convertor went in my 99 Stroke at 70k miles. Thank God for the extended warranty.
4l80e way better tranny. Of course a Suncoast rebuild can cure the problem at a hefty price.
 
Not everyone has set a 6.5 up for true success, to where the power gap can get quite a bit smaller. Granted a powerful 6.5 takes a few more modifications, compared to just a programmer on the newer common rail direct injection'ers. Put the money and time in and you too can have a powerful, reliable 6.5TD that doesnt overheat. I suppose ideally, a no rust truck with a blown engine is cheapest, $1k max, and if you put $9K worth of engine and modifications into it you could have what you seek.

If youre looking to pull 20K lbs long distance the 6.5 isnt going to be a good fit, this much is true. If you want to pull 8-12K lbs long distance the 6.5 can be built to do it comfortably, while maintaining most speed limits. If you just need to take stuff to the next town and are patient it can pull more.
 
Just to confirm at present the last thing I need is another vehicle to insure plate & buy city tags for.

I am like normal always looking for a good deal on vehicles that I would like to obtain.

This post was mostly to gain input from the vast knowledge base of the members here and to provide others with generalizations about our diesel SUV options.

Yes I am admitting my addiction affliction with diesels...trying hard to keep my desires in check.

Thanks for sharing yr experiences & thoughts and any all additional ones are certainly welcome.

B/r
Greg

One other thing...with today's fuel cost who the hell can really afford to pull 20K across the country anymore anyhow? The Excursion may be a much heavier duty vehicle that has more pulling power, but what about the unloaded MPG daily use of it compared to our beloved 6.5?

I am betting if we can avg 17mpg with a 6.5 4wd burb that a 4wd Excursion with 7.3 would be lucky to avg 14...???
 
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Another question how does the Ford engine do on bio-diesel? Does it like it like an old 6.2?


Crankme69 said:
Just to confirm at present the last thing I need is another vehicle to insure plate & buy city tags for.

I am like normal always looking for a good deal on vehicles that I would like to obtain.

This post was mostly to gain input from the vast knowledge base of the members here and to provide others with generalizations about our diesel SUV options.

Yes I am admitting my addiction affliction with diesels...trying hard to keep my desires in check.

Thanks for sharing yr experiences & thoughts and any all additional ones are certainly welcome.

B/r
Greg

One other thing...with today's fuel cost who the hell can really afford to pull 20K across the country anymore anyhow? The Excursion may be a much heavier duty vehicle that has more pulling power, but what about the unloaded MPG daily use of it compared to our beloved 6.5?

I am betting if we can avg 17mpg with a 6.5 4wd burb that a 4wd Excursion with 7.3 would be lucky to avg 14...???
Click to expand...
 
I've read that you need a custom oil pan for the P 400 to fit over the front axle of a 4wd.
 
Acesneights1 said:
Also something to consider on the Duraburb...This co out of Fl converting them ...are they reegistered with the EPA ? In other words undertsand that all states differ i n requirements for emissions testing. Ferms Burb would not pass a ct emissions test regardless of what's coming out the tailpipe because here in Commyneticut they hook to the OBD2 port and on a 9x whatever Burb the computer will read the year and vin of whatever donor truck the Dmax came out of correct ? They would not proceed any further . It is against federal epa regs to modify a vehichles fuel or emissions system which a Dmax conversion is doing. Of course on old stuff that is exepmt from testing or in states where there is none or states like NY where you can grease the guy it doesn't matter but know your states regs first. Alot of guys with 6.0 fords are doing 12v conversions. A Gasser Excursion can be had for next to nothing. They are completly worthless. You could buy one of those and drop a 12v in way cheaper than a 99+ Exc with a 7.3(save for a wrung out hag) but you'll never get a sticker on it around here.
Click to expand...

Mine would pass emissions no problem in any state. Mine is an OBD1 truck, so they wouldn't even hooh-up to the OBD2 port. The federal law states that you can do a conversion to another diesel engine so long as it is of the same year or newer than the origanal engine and you transfer over all of the emissions equipment from the donor vehicle so that it meets the emssions regs for the donor vehicle. The tricky part for the DURABURBS though is that GM never built a GMT-800 SUV with a diesel, so you could be SOL in some states with that one. Going from a gas to a diesel is where it gets tricky, but going from a diesel to a newer diesel is very doable.
 
The drawbacks to the 4X4 EXCURSIONS is that FORD got the bright idea to install softer springs in the front end and lower it down from the SUPER DUTIES. Since they lowered it down they had to install lesser arch rear springs which meant they had to be very stiff to hold the extra rear weight of the X and strill be able to hold up tongue weight. A F-350 SRW truck has 385 LB rear springs where as an EXCURSION has 410 LB springs. Quite a few of the guys over at TDS have swapped out the EXCURSION springs for F-250 front and rear springs along with RANCH or BILSTEIN shocks, larger sway bars, and a set of 03+ bump stops in the front end(in 03 FORD went to a TIMBREN style bump stop in teh front end since the X sat so low it rode on the bump stops). If it has the 7.3L it will have the 4R100 trans in it which is pretty stout, but the torque converters in them are weak and the FORD valve body gives way to soft of a shift. And of course the 7.3L PS has injector problems if the oil isn't changed often, the wonderful high pressure oil crossover line that leaks or pops, and the stock high pressure oil pump can't keep up with much of a tune most of the time.

I almost bought an EXCURSION until I rode in one, after that my BURB got a DURAMAX.
 
You could always do this...but to A BURB...

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The emissions issue is something that I had not considered, but definitely has merit. I'm sure this issue is not going to improve any time soon.

The Excursion ride details are interesting. Just the opposite of what I would had thought. Being as though the Excursion us a heavier vehicle ? I would have guessed that would have provided an improved ride quality. Wrong again hey.

That Cumins burb is AWESOME!

I wish I had the shop tools & knowledge to custom build my own conversion, but I don't.

Many things to consider for sure...

Many great replies thanks!
 
Crankme69 said:
That Cumins burb is AWESOME!

I wish I had the shop tools & knowledge to custom build my own conversion, but I don't.

Many great replies thanks!
Click to expand...

those pics are of a Red dually from Louisiana...I just thought one of you should do this...but to a Burb!

....IIRC that truck was twin turbo'd...it's been two years so i really can't remember...maybe one of the Gulf Coast gang that were there with me can refresh my memory for me...
 
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