Loganshaw_6
Member
Currently in the bed. I didn't think about that
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1998 6.5 shuts off past 170° f
- Thread starter Loganshaw_6
- Start date
Loganshaw_6
Member
Would that really cause the pump to get hot?
Will L.
Well-Known Member
Idk. My theory is when you know something isn’t right, fix it and watch the effects. Especially when something is acting goofy.
Loganshaw_6
Member
Well currently I have the truck at pure diesel getting worked on. I'm wondering if my snap-on scanner is showing me different results while timing the pump. They have a GM tech 2 and a few guys who are old school and have been working on these things for years hopefully they get somewhere on it.
Will L.
Well-Known Member
I remember snapon having issues with the 6.5 world. I remember giving back one to my snappy guy and getting an OTC genisus instead over it. There is some kind of work around but a bidirectional scanner should have one issue, cost. Mind you I have never been the go to ‘drive ability’ guy in any shop I worked in.
Let us know what they come up with
Let us know what they come up with
Loganshaw_6
Member
well I just spoke with them and they said the pump is timed correctly but the computer thinks it is not timed correctly. The TDC offset value keeps jumping around and changing he claimed. With a labor rate of $110 an hour it's hard to tell him to keep going but I said throw another 3 hours at it at the most for right now.
Rockabillyrat
SlIgHtLy StUpId.
Hopefully they will finally give you an answer on what the problem is. I know your at wits end with that truck, but I LOVE when I get an "impossible" truck to fix at work. Diagnostic work is my favorite.... but of course I'm not paying for it so I would feel differently if I did.
Judging by what they told you the next step I would do would be to scope the cam/optical and crank sensor. Also id check the alternator for excessive AC ripple. AC voltage can wreak havok on sensor signals.
Judging by what they told you the next step I would do would be to scope the cam/optical and crank sensor. Also id check the alternator for excessive AC ripple. AC voltage can wreak havok on sensor signals.
Rockabillyrat
SlIgHtLy StUpId.
He already did....
Will L.
Well-Known Member
Throw a db2 and stand alone trans controller at it and be done if emissions is ok there
Loganshaw_6
Member
Yeah this truck is becoming a pain.
Id love that but I'm invested already into this DS4
Loganshaw_6
Member
So I got a call from pure Diesel about my truck. They have checked everything and now want to pull the timing covers to check the timing and check the key on the cam gear, I told them not to because I'm capable of doing that work. I believe they said the tdc offset value keeps jumping around when they run the truck. It's been a few days since I spoke with them and my memory is slightly fuzzy but that is where we stand now. He sent me this printout as well. I compression tested cylinder 1 weeks ago while the truck was still a bit warm and if I remember correctly I got about 400psi on that cylinder. That is The only cylinder that I tested. The truck runs well cool but it is also dumping extra fuel. I still don't hate 6.5s And I can't say that they are bad engines but I sure do hate this one. Luckily I bought a 1995 cab and chassis for parts so if it comes down to it I have a cam, chain, gear, key, and everything I need assuming that it is all in good shape. I haven't inspected it so I may go with new parts depending on what they look like. Probably a new chain either way.
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ak diesel driver
6.5 driver
So I don't feel like rereading this but did you check out the CPS? Did you do the tests on both the CPS and OS?
Loganshaw_6
Member
Yes. Won't start with either unplugged. AC Delco CPS
Rockabillyrat
SlIgHtLy StUpId.
You can check cam and crank correlation with a lab scope. Overlay them on a 2 channel scope and see if they are in time. Saves ALOT of diag time. Probably have to command the IP to do a time set so it holds the timing steady.
ak diesel driver
6.5 driver
How long did you crank it? It takes ALOT of cranking to get it to start in limp mode
It's possible you have a timing chain problem. The advice above is good and you can work it out with what tests the shop did.
DO NOT PUT A USED CHAIN IN IT! By the time you get the front of the engine ripped off to get to the chain you will understand the difference between being frugal and being cheap. The Chain can't handle the shock loads from the IP and stretches out in less than 30K miles. The chain is a bean counter hangover from the Olds 5.7 diesel when most all the other diesel engines use a gear. It appears to run ok stretched out, but, one has to adjust timing often. DS4's may do this on their own: I forget. FWIW The expected "Emissions Life" on these engines back in the day was 50K miles.
Shop pulls it apart and sees a "Sloppy" chain... Uh, this is NORMAL! The slop allowed is nearly a mind blowing inch of deflection!
Here is a worn out crankshaft key example.
Sloppy chain...
DO NOT PUT A USED CHAIN IN IT! By the time you get the front of the engine ripped off to get to the chain you will understand the difference between being frugal and being cheap. The Chain can't handle the shock loads from the IP and stretches out in less than 30K miles. The chain is a bean counter hangover from the Olds 5.7 diesel when most all the other diesel engines use a gear. It appears to run ok stretched out, but, one has to adjust timing often. DS4's may do this on their own: I forget. FWIW The expected "Emissions Life" on these engines back in the day was 50K miles.
Shop pulls it apart and sees a "Sloppy" chain... Uh, this is NORMAL! The slop allowed is nearly a mind blowing inch of deflection!
Here is a worn out crankshaft key example.
1992 6.5TD Rescue
I have used tractor loader and ratchet strap, now I use a body shop lol
www.thetruckstop.us
Sloppy chain...
Bringing 1993 Patch back from the dead...
Question, do you plan to do anything at all to the crank, or just clean and go? I am checking on my bearing supply and will let you know when I do.. .013 = .0005" .026 = .001" Edit, missed a 0 ---- .013 = .0005"
www.thetruckstop.us
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Loganshaw_6
Member
Howdy y'all long time no speak. So I finally found motivation to tear apart the truck. I was told to pull the cover and check the cam for a sheared key. I see nothing wrong with the cam so yet again I'm stuck. Unfortunately I paid no attention to the timing marks on the injection pump and the gear on the cam to see if they lined up but is it possible to have the injection pump mechanically timed wrong but timed properly electronically? The reason I was told to check the cam was because my TDC offset value keeps jumping around after the truck is shut off and restarted.
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STOP!!! By the pictures you need to step back before you pull the chain off. You don't have the crank and cam timed properly!!! You are timing the crank sprocket off the IP gear and that's a rookie mistake.
This engine has two separate items to time with two sets of marks: cam and crank then cam and injection pump.
So you time the IP gear to the IP cam gear with the dots matching.
The crank sprocket and cam sprocket are timed by dots as well on the sprockets: ignore the IP gears to time the chain.
DO NOT ROTATE THE ENGINE WITH THE CHAIN OFF. Or you will bend a valve.
This engine has two separate items to time with two sets of marks: cam and crank then cam and injection pump.
So you time the IP gear to the IP cam gear with the dots matching.
The crank sprocket and cam sprocket are timed by dots as well on the sprockets: ignore the IP gears to time the chain.
DO NOT ROTATE THE ENGINE WITH THE CHAIN OFF. Or you will bend a valve.
Loganshaw_6
Member
I noticed that I needed to time both sets and upon observing the pictures more it appears somebody has been in here before. Since I don't necessarily see anything damaged I am going to time everything and reassemble the pump and front cover to see what it does.