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Peninsular Engines towing turbo?

Project57IDI you are new here and it isn't about wheel sizes or turbos, it is and does go much deeper than that for some posters. That is all I am going to say, and YES I "ask" key word is "ask" most purchasers if they would not post any specifications. I am on first name basis with all of my purchasers, they can call me anytime they have a problem with their truck related to my product or not. I even installed one of my purchasers turbos myself (did not charge him for the install) because the original shop botched the job so badly. So there it is, not that I owe an explanation.
 
F'r crying out loud, people... We don't need the drama.

Who CARES about the specs? A few self-proclaimed 'experts' decided that they could use numbers in strange ways to start a turbo war. They neglected simple (but important) things like turbo exhaust back pressure, mass airflow, the appopriateness of the tune to the application, etc.

We had a similar reverence for Dyno tests, until WW did one and proved (head-to-head comparison, same truck, different turbos) something that many already knew.. The ATT is a very good turbo, delivers exactly what it promises, and is a superior bolt-on enhancement.

Since then, we have been very cautious and skeptical around here when somebody starts making claims they can't back up. We don't need numbers to see through it.
 
X2 on JIFaire post. You can call Dennis, and Leroy who also sells them and get great customer service. I love my ATT and could care less about science as long as results are there(+2mpg is best result imo). The price point is great also.
 
Project57idi said:
So does one have to sign a non-disclosure agreement when they buy an ATT? I mean, why is the wheel sizing such a big damn secret? NO ONE wants to share any information about this turbo. Very cloak and dagger. And when confronted with this fact, all slim does is talk about proven results (which are mo doubt proven) and investment ( again, no doubts about that either) etc. Garret and B/W have millions more invested and the only spec you can't find on those turbos is an accurate turbine flow map. I mean, is it really that big of a deal to give out the specs of what are most likely off the shelf wheels and housings?
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The B.S. stops when the flag drops. In my case the dyno rollers at a Dodge forum dyno pull off day. I didn't come in dead last. I say my smoke was on par at least... :hihi: All I am interested in are results and specifically where it saves me money in MPG and also increases power for (working hard) towing. You can see the turbocharger sizes in a pic I posted up of 3 of them.

The ATT is not off the shelf as the housings undergo more machining for the 'not off the shelf' down pipe adapter. If Dennis wants to keep the specs 'trade secret' to prevent copies it is his call. After all the undeserved bad press I do not blame him for doing so for all reasons. Dennis doesn't have millions invested and will treat you better than the places that do - esp. vs. Banks. Few years ago the standard formula on the forum was turn up the fuel, add a turbomaster and 4" exhaust. (Bad expensive information when there are better solutions out there. Esp when you go from 7 MPG standard old formula ideas to 10.4 MPG with an ATT towing 550 miles a day.) Peninsular and Dennis both share a common failure in marketing of their turbo. Dennis has improved the marketing. After being seriously tarred and feathered. To give you an idea of bad marketing: I have purchased parts off Peninsular's site years ago and did not know about their turbo!

There is more info out there on the ATT than there is on the Peninsular turbo. This is why I asked to see if anyone has results or other info.

I have seen the 'crowd' thinking of how to get power out of a 6.5 change in a few short years I have owned one. Not only that but the info has become easier to find. The more vendors that are offering a better turbo for the 6.5 the easier it gets to help others understand the problem GM left us and understand the $1,000.00 investment to change the turbo is really worth it. (And will pay you back in fuel under high load.)
 
This thread is about penninsular's turbo. I derailed it. Sorry. I'll cry about lack of specs in a more appropriate time/place if I still need to :)

Carry on gents.
 
Project57idi said:
This thread is about penninsular's turbo. I derailed it. Sorry. I'll cry about lack of specs in a more appropriate time/place if I still need to :)

Carry on gents.
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Very sensitive subject around the 6.5 world and some like to stir the pot. We've been down this road many times and many heated conversations later, folks get jumpy and lock and load for the possible gunfight. So don't worry about it...
 
Why is it when someone starts a "turbo" thread it brings out the absolute worst in people?
 
Back to WW's post & question - as the thread doesn't appear to have been started to discuss other turbos so much. The reason I brought up Peninsular's long experience with their marine engine packages is this:

Try to think of any other 6.5 parts vendor that has Peninsular's degree of experience with 6.5's running in combinations beyond stock GM output. And these aren't inexpensive engine combinations. You can bet they're exceptionally aware of failures because they've got a financial stake in the outcome when an engine fails within warranty coverage.

I'm not knocking any of the 6.5 vendors; just wondering who would have more experience with 6.5's that are modified for performance levels beyond stock GM? More specifically, statistically large numbers of engines, but a finite number of different combinations, so analyzing correlations & cause/effects aren't confounded by umpteen different combinations.

I'd bet Ferm's point regarding cylinder pressure (peak & average) is their primary concern relating to deciding a boost limit relating to durability. Next, the longer its gonna run at peak power/load, the more conservative you gotta be if endurance/durability is important. And on a boat, the quickest responding turbo is less important.
 
Bill Heath, John Kennedy, Chicago TDP, Canadian Rigger, Turbine Doc, and a bunch of other guys have all made (relatively) big power with the 6.5td.

Anybody who elected to run over 15 psi also went with studs, new cometics, and made sure the top end was fine. Anybody who elected to run high boost and more fuel also beefed up the bottom end (girdles, splayed mains, forged cranks, etc). Most also added new pistons and went to 18:1, like our esteemed friend SmithvilleD.

Don't say it can't be done, but understand that if you want to survive the experience, it can't be done for long without making concurrent modifications to things.

The best things about the ATT are it's bolt-on, it eliminates the need for an intercooler, better flow, better mpg, and more power. With the new tuning that Dennis, Ferm, and others are working on, it will get even better.

I want happy owners around here, and pretty well everyone who has one is happy. Some guys are happy with other turbos, and that's a good thing, too.

If somebody isn't happy, be unhappy quietly, ok?

And 5.7idi, don't take my little rant personally. It wasn't aimed at you, it was just preventative maintenance. :D
 
FWIW, there's a guy around here, that mentioned to me, "when you want to get crazy, I've got a machined from billet 6.5 block."

I didn't inquire further, but his family has pretty serious tractor pulling experience & track record. So I don't necesarily doubt he's got something like that. If I see him at a pulling event this summer, I'll ask a little more about it.
 
ak diesel driver said:
I'll bet that was/is pricey
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I could get in touch with him & find out more, if somebody here had legitimate interest. Having seen the competitiveness of the pulling tractors they run, as well as some built for others, they know a little something about making big diesel hp. And I'm told the CNC facility he works at can do that kind of work. Won't further hijack WW's thread, just mentioned it relation to folks that have pushed the envelope of 6.5 hp.
 
Peninsular should have this in their featured items on their website. Maybe make the build article public instead of in a paid book that 6.5 owners don't have a budget for. Regardless thanks for the info on it. I just wish I had run across it years ago as it may have saved me trip time and or fuel. Hopefully it will help break the info vacuum on 6.5 turbo's. This makes a second vendor that has a 6.5 turbo that is better than stock vs. the fleabay unknown.

Did the article mention if MPG towing improved over a stock turbo?
 
Don't believe so - the article was about the overall engine build including fabbed girdle, custom roller rockers, thermal barrier & friction reducing coatings, etc.

Could be Peninsular would have some fuel economy, or at least gals/hr info from their marine engines that might correlate to this turbo. Don't know, but would hazard a guess that this towing turbo (or at least the sizing choices) might relate to their marine engine turbos, but without the water-cooled turbine & exhaust housings?
 
JiFaire, no harm no foul. I've been on car forums for too long to take anything personally on the interwebs. I just found myself starting to rant on something that was taking this particular thread waaaaayyyyy off course. That's why my reply was so short. It was alot more long winded before I erased the whole thing and changed it. Like I said, carry on!
 
THEFERMANATOR said:
I would think the 15 PSI limit comes in from basic math. A stock 6.5 with say 400-425 lbs of compression at 15 pounds of boost would be close to 700-750 pounds of compression(figuring in for some airflow loss due to port sizes and such). Since your dealing with a light duty diesel platform, that kind of compression is quite a bit. Even the DURAMAX in stock form using similar formulas tries to be around 900 or so for compression, and that is a true medium duty engine. Can you go higher, of course. The question is from a longevity stand point they recommend the ceiling at 2 atmospheres or 15 PSI of boost. And also once you reach a certain amount of boost you hit the diminishing return point where you can push more air, but you just don't see the gains like you did up to a conservative setting. This is why I tend to keep my boost numbers down to a conservative level is I know I can push more boost and see more power, but at what expense to longevity does it come at. So I tune for a slight haze at WOT and call it good. Yes I'm leaving say 3-5% of power on the table, but the lower cylinder pressures to me seem worth it. If you want to see some real gains, you can do like the DMAX guys are now doing. Find some better cylinder heads. The guys who were pushing 100-125 pounds of boost are now seeing 70-80 with the same set-ups with aftermarket heads, and making MORE HP. As has been discussed before, you need airflow. And boost will give you more airflow, but it also comes at a cost.
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I disagree to a point what your saying. 15 psi isn't always 15 psi, so if your comparing the stock turbo to say the ATT or an HX40 then the latter have more mass of air or density at 15 psi than a stock turbo. Fueling does play a role but so does turbo size, backpressure etc. Boost is simply a measure of restriction and believe it or not, air speed does not change in the intake system with a turbo.

I would probably agree that more boost can equal more stress etc but there are quite a few people running 20, 30 psi with no ill effects.
 
Without trying to start something, I'll just throw this out:

271.9 hp @ 3200 rpm / 446.3 tq @ 1900 rpm at the wheels and that was on a dyno dynamics 450. DD's are widely recognized as the stingiest dyno's out there and they are nicknamed "the heartbreaker" because of it. Those numbers are without any power adders like Meth, propane, nitrous, etc. I do have post turbo water injection (devils own progressive) but it was inop that day (and inop since then) due to a roached pump.

I won't say what turbo I use because it's not popular round these parts and it only starts controversy that doesn't need to be in this thread. I know what I use and it works for me, that will have to be good enuff. That's not to say I'm not up for a new experiment when my current setup wears out.

;)

The turbo is a part of making power on these engines, but not the only thing that matters. It's more a supporting cast member than the main character in this play.

There are many misconceptions rolling about regarding turbo's on a 6.X. I also won't go in to that either as it would just be more controversy that doesn't need to be here.

Mine is limited to 13 psi max before it pops off (yup, it's wastegated. yup, it makes use of the OEM vacuum system). Something that was denounced as not possible and build the power I'm seeing, many times, in many places, by many people.

Yup, it runs strong. Yup, it gets nearly 19 MPG. Yup, it runs below 1100 F when towing.

It took nearly 8 hours on the Dyno to sort that all out. It was a fun day for all involved and a very good mutual learning experience.

I will also say that Ferm seems to have a decent handle about what's going down underneath those big thick head castings....take from that what you will.

:)
 
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