• Welcome to The Truck Stop! We see you haven't REGISTERED yet.

    Your truck knowledge is missing!
    • Registration is FREE , all we need is your birthday and email. (We don't share ANY data with ANYONE)
    • We have tons of knowledge here for your diesel truck!
    • Post your own topics and reply to existing threads to help others out!
    • NO ADS! The site is fully functional and ad free!
    CLICK HERE TO REGISTER!

    Problems registering? Click here to contact us!

    Already registered, but need a PASSWORD RESET? CLICK HERE TO RESET YOUR PASSWORD!

Injector pump timing?

5

540s10

New Member
Messages
249
Reaction score
3
Location
Shrewsbury,MA
Put a scan tool on my truck today figured I would take a look and see what the timing was since I had it and found something strange... here are my results

Using autoenginuity-

water temp 185*
Desired Timing 12.1*
Actual Timing 12.1*
TDCO 2.46

I entered the time set mode and actual timing read 3.3/3.4

yes it it triggered the SES light

codes p0216 and p1214

cleared the codes and did a TDCO learn (KOKO just to make sure it worked) but there was no change to the offset

any ideas what could cause this? From all my reading I've concluded that when the actual timing is at 3.5 I should have an offset of -.25 -.75 .

the truck runs well before it gets up to temp (bad injectors considering) but stumbles once it reaches the Magic operating temp number where it sets the codes into the ecm.
 
I am assuming TDCO is -2.46. If that is the case the pump needs to be turned a smidge to the passenger side. The max you want to see is -1.93 for max performance. -1.5 for best overall performance w/ fuel economy.
 
Rodd said:
I am assuming TDCO is -2.46. If that is the case the pump needs to be turned a smidge to the passenger side. The max you want to see is -1.93 for max performance. -1.5 for best overall performance w/ fuel economy.
Click to expand...

It is saying that its positive 2.46, It still doesn't add up to the base timing though, from what I can figure, even if the offset was reading a -2.46 then when I did the time set, it would show the base timing to be upwards of 9* advanced.

Is there anything I can adjust that will change the offset independent of base timing?
 
So since it is positive you need to turn the pump toward the driver side. When I did my timing it came right into sync once I got the TDCO set.
 
Rodd said:
I am assuming TDCO is -2.46. If that is the case the pump needs to be turned a smidge to the passenger side. The max you want to see is -1.93 for max performance. -1.5 for best overall performance w/ fuel economy.
Click to expand...

I never heard -1.94 had worse economy than -1.5, just sounds scary starting it in really cold climates.

S10540, I've been waiting along time for someoen to come around with a scanner and capabilities to adjust TDCO to -1.5. I bought scanner software (carcode), still waiting on finding a freebie old laptop....

What kind of beer do you drink? :)
 
Matt Bachand said:
I never heard -1.94 had worse economy than -1.5, just sounds scary starting it in really cold climates.

S10540, I've been waiting along time for someoen to come around with a scanner and capabilities to adjust TDCO to -1.5. I bought scanner software (carcode), still waiting on finding a freebie old laptop....

What kind of beer do you drink? :)
Click to expand...

It came from Bill Heath IIRC.
 
Matt Bachand said:
Maybe I forgot smileys or mis-worded it. I'm not saying its not true, but I thought I would remember that.

Perhaps like anything else, the opposite of performance is economy.:thumbsup:
Click to expand...

It was a thread back at the place a couple of years ago where he said it. I have seen a few threads here where guy's have quoted the same thing. I believe Tim and JD have also made mention of it.

I disagree that the opposite of performance is economy. If that were the case then all the mods we do wouldn't increase fuel economy. Just look at the ATT, heath reflash, etc. We all do mods for performance but economy comes w/ it as long as we aren't racing all over the place.:D
 
I have a noticeable power gain at -1.94 compared to -1.32 where I set it now because it was so loud when cold in the morning. I don't know about fuel economy, never tracked it close enough, except I'd say I got better when it was closer to like -0.5, but at a performance hit especially off the line and top end, in the middle its all about the same.

So back to the issue, if the scanner is the right version, then you need to get it towards the drivers side. There should be a wedge on the timing cover that the IP mount corner kind of lines up with, except you want it slightly towards driver side. Timing these things is really easy once you know how, and have an S bend wrench, or the right tools.
 
Rodd said:
It was a thread back at the place a couple of years ago where he said it. I have seen a few threads here where guy's have quoted the same thing. I believe Tim and JD have also made mention of it.

I disagree that the opposite of performance is economy. If that were the case then all the mods we do wouldn't increase fuel economy. Just look at the ATT, heath reflash, etc. We all do mods for performance but economy comes w/ it as long as we aren't racing all over the place.:D
Click to expand...

Touche! Assuming you can keep your foot out of it! Should have frased it, maximum performance gain almost always has an economical side effect.
 
Matt Bachand said:
I never heard -1.94 had worse economy than -1.5, just sounds scary starting it in really cold climates.

S10540, I've been waiting along time for someoen to come around with a scanner and capabilities to adjust TDCO to -1.5. I bought scanner software (carcode), still waiting on finding a freebie old laptop....

What kind of beer do you drink? :)
Click to expand...

I have an OLD laptop that was too unstable to run the software for tuning my s10, ill check that it still starts up and what not, and if it appears to run, ill trade ya for rental of that injector socket... I think this weekend I may try to make my own wrench for gettin at the pump nuts with the upper intake still on.




back to the original topic,

could a misaligned optical sensor cause the discrepancy in my numbers?
ive been doin some reading here and it seems like the base timing is in reference to the crank sensor, while the offset is determined from the optical sensor in the pump?
 
buddy said:
I have a noticeable power gain at -1.94 compared to -1.32 where I set it now because it was so loud when cold in the morning. I don't know about fuel economy, never tracked it close enough, except I'd say I got better when it was closer to like -0.5, but at a performance hit especially off the line and top end, in the middle its all about the same.

So back to the issue, if the scanner is the right version, then you need to get it towards the drivers side. There should be a wedge on the timing cover that the IP mount corner kind of lines up with, except you want it slightly towards driver side. Timing these things is really easy once you know how, and have an S bend wrench, or the right tools.
Click to expand...

im pretty sure the scanner is working as it should, the onyl thing the concerns me about just rotating the pump, is that the relationship between the two numbers isn't on par with everyone elses... I don't want to rotate the pump and then have my base timing be in the teens in order to obtain an acceptable offset number.
 
Well, my GMTDScanTech tells me the truth in timing, and yes at 3.5 degrees it is more like -0.5 to -0.75 and closer to 4 degrees is -1.94, however someone once said that scanners will always show around 3.5, some GM conspiracy. Mine I have set from 2 to 10 degrees base timing and could see it on the scanner.

But thats why I told you about the location of the IP mount to the timing mark. The offset changes at a much higher rate than the base timing as well, so move it like a centimeter towards driver and it might not go up in base timing but offset back in the -0.75 range. The worst that happens is it goes out of tolerance more like it already is.
 
540s10 said:
im pretty sure the scanner is working as it should, the onyl thing the concerns me about just rotating the pump, is that the relationship between the two numbers isn't on par with everyone elses... I don't want to rotate the pump and then have my base timing be in the teens in order to obtain an acceptable offset number.
Click to expand...

Is there a chance you have a reflashed pcm? My 99 has a stock mysterious 215 hp pcm. My timing is much higher than the 3.5. It was 12.6 at -88.5 tdco. Check out my thread regarding this http://www.dieseltowingresource.com/showthread.php?t=11787&highlight=rodd
Remember the higher the timing the more performance you'll see (to a point).
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top