Injection Pump TDCO @ -2.46 what do I need to do ?

[scubabri]

with my TDCO reading -2.46 in car-code, will I need to move the pump to retard the tdco?

I'm debating if I want to try to do it, or take it to a dealer to do it. I'll be towing this summer, so it needs to get done.

 

[NVW]

Welcome to the site.

You will have to turn the IP 1mm to pass side. Then go from there.

 

[buddy]

with my TDCO reading -2.46 in car-code, will I need to move the pump to retard the tdco?

I'm debating if I want to try to do it, or take it to a dealer to do it. I'll be towing this summer, so it needs to get done.

Do you also hace DTC for TDCO, telling you its out of tolerance. If so then yes you need to retard it towards passenger side. If not then Carcode must not be reporting it correctly.

 

[scubabri]

yah, getting 0216 and 1214

 

[scubabri]

oh, and it runs pretty good, no smoke, and power enough to tow my 35' fiver

 

[Matt Bachand]

What year vehicle? The 96+ with dual thermostats are ALOT tougher to turn vs the pre 96 with the singe t-stat housing. The later dual t-stat housing makes it alot tougher. If you can fabricate your own wrench with a torch giving it a radius and a 1/2 offset , then I'd say your more than capable of doing this job easily. The only tough part of the entire job is getting that bottom bolt loosened.

If your already stuck with the thought of bending your own wrench to imitate a specialty wrench to reach the lowest bolt on the IP, then have the dealer do it! Clean it real good, and make a good scribeline so you can make sure, and it will help the guy too. Make that engine spotless, make mechanic happy!

Also, is this an area where if you went into TIMESET and read the actual timing in car-code to find base timing would help determine how much movement required? What numbers do you have there?

When in TimeSet the stepper motor isn't changing timing via PCM command. Its actual base timing. Once time-set is over, the PCM resumes control of the timing via the stepper motor, and the timing readings between the two should be completely different.

 

[scubabri]

mine is a 97 K3500 F VIN. I took it to the dealer this morning, waiting to hear back.

The engine is as clean as I could get it. All the spots I could get to are free of dirt and grease.

I'm getting -2.46 TDCO

 

[buddy]

Well, the dealer is usually the biggest rip off. And I dont know if they will set it to where you want it, or just to factory timing procedure. Need to tell them to set it to -1.5 to -1.94 TDCO.

 

[scubabri]

I did, we'll see.

 

[Matt Bachand]

Nothing wrong with factory specs. Better than out of range! Did you make a scribe line?

 

[scubabri]

well bad news, the dealer wasnt able to work me in, so I'm waiting until monday to get in.

In everyones opinion, is retarding the IP the only thing I need (-2.46 tdco) or could there be something else more.... expensive happening?

 

[buddy]

How did you get to -2.46? Did you actually run the TDCO relearn or koko procedure? If you havent you should run it and verify that your pump is actually still there. And if you mess with rpms by pressing the pedal while its learning then it could fall into spec without moving the IP.

 

[Turbine Doc]

well bad news, the dealer wasnt able to work me in, so I'm waiting until monday to get in.

In everyones opinion, is retarding the IP the only thing I need (-2.46 tdco) or could there be something else more.... expensive happening?

if you would please go to the User CP button and add in a truck profile to your signature it makes it easier post to post to remember which truck we are talking about, also best if you are having problems on your vehicle to create a post for just your vehicle,

It will need to be backed away from -2.46 is that is where you actually are at, 1st confirm that value, with engine coolant >170 F.

 

[Turbine Doc]

If the TDCO is @ -2.46 then it is too far advanced, without special tools it is hard to adjust the IP, even with the IP wrench set you have to have some good dexterity. I loosen the 2 lower nuts to just snug, then loosen top nut and just bump the IP turning tool the direction I need to move it, 1mm of movement is about 3 deg of timing change. for total timing. Once you get IP to where you want it, lock down tight the top locknut.

KO/KO App to floor has to be done for the move to take effect if you don't have a scanner like car code that allows TDCO to be commanded by the scan tool.

 

[buddy]

1mm is like .25 cam degrees which would be .5 crank degrees. When we set TDCO to -.5 its setting the base timing at 7 degrees crank, because its 3.5 cam degrees. In timeset you see 3.5 actual/0 desired/-.5 TDCO. You bump it to -1.94 TDCO and youre at almost 4 cam degrees, which is 8 degrees crank base timing.

I read a service bulletin that claimed 1mm is about 2 degrees (doesnt define cam or crank), and thats obviously not really true.

 

[scubabri]

when I bought the truck it was throwing 2 codes. I've replaced injectors, glow plugs, put a 4" diamond eye, 2 1/2 crossover, replaced and relocated the pmd, oil change, transmission flush, new tires, replaced the wiper control board.

When I got it it was stalling randomly, blowing white smoke on start, and was hard to start first thing in the morning and blowing black smoke when I floored it. Now it runs pretty good, decent power, and no smoke to speak of, but still throwing the codes 1214 and 0216. I got the car-code scanner, the tdco was -2.46 and hasnt changed. I got the temp up to 185, tried to do a TDCO Learn, but it never changed.

My ipt and iptd seem to fluctuate while driving and are close to each other, but while at idle, they are generally 5-6 off from each other (iptd 12 or so, while ipt is 6 or so)

according to the PO, he has never touched the IP, other than replacing the PMD and putting a heatsink on after moving it to the upper intake.

 

[buddy]

And you are using the carcode procedure that was defined by qwomack on here?
http://www.thetruckstop.us/forum/showpost.php?p=116285&postcount=22

You have to be in the correct settings to do TDCO. I guess the important one being select the 02 group.

It sounds like the base timing is 6 degrees which would be too advanced and the stepper motor isnt functioning at idle.

If the dealer couldnt get you in its because they dont really know how to do the procedure because its not time consuming.

Verify you are using the carcode correctly by reading that OBD-II thread.

If setting the TDCO correctly becomes impossible it could be that the crank sensor is malfunctioning or installed incorrectly.

 

[scubabri]

I got the ECT up to 180, and followed the procedure in quomacks doc. According to the dealer, they were putting a IP in a 95 and it was a priority because the one that they just put in off the shelf failed after about 30 miles. I'm going to take it over monday and let them have it all week if need be.

Is there any way to test to see if the crank sensor is functional? would a faulty sensor give the -2.46 reading?

 

[buddy]

You can check the stepper motor and make sure it is properly latched. Its external on the side of the IP, it has a little hook of sorts that engages. If its not latched properly might cause your issues. Hard to see on the passenger side of the IP, would need to take intake off possibly. Maybe an inspection mirror and flashlight.

Crank sensor can cause wrong timing readings and make TDCO impossible to set. But its hard to tell anything without some more testing.

 

[scubabri]

I pulled the stepper a couple weeks ago, it appeared to be seized, so I soaked it in wd40, and the reinstalled it. I made sure it was latched. I can also see that its moving when the throttle is pressed.

Would the optic sensor cause the same codes? I noticed that injection pump timing counts (I think thats the sensor) is not 0.