• Welcome to The Truck Stop! We see you haven't REGISTERED yet.

    Your truck knowledge is missing!
    • Registration is FREE , all we need is your birthday and email. (We don't share ANY data with ANYONE)
    • We have tons of knowledge here for your diesel truck!
    • Post your own topics and reply to existing threads to help others out!
    • NO ADS! The site is fully functional and ad free!
    CLICK HERE TO REGISTER!

    Problems registering? Click here to contact us!

    Already registered, but need a PASSWORD RESET? CLICK HERE TO RESET YOUR PASSWORD!

Dual Pyro?

I don’t see why two. Running one before the turbo tells ya what ya need to know.

If you want them, it is common in aircraft to use a dual needle single gauge. They are nice quality and very accurate- but most people spend the same amount of money ans get a normal automotive egt, a turbo, a turbo blanket, and still have enough money to fill the tank half way instead.
 
Will L. said:
I don’t see why two. Running one before the turbo tells ya what ya need to know.

If you want them, it is common in aircraft to use a dual needle single gauge. They are nice quality and very accurate- but most people spend the same amount of money ans get a normal automotive egt, a turbo, a turbo blanket, and still have enough money to fill the tank half way instead.
Click to expand...
He said from what he read two is recommended on the N/A engines 🤷🏽‍♂️ And yeah he mentioned the aircraft ones and the price, probably not an option lol.
 
Here’s the thing: you COULD have a cylinder on the left side running hotter than the right side. But you shouldn’t. We know cylinders 7&8 are the hottest, thats why they have slightly different specs in the engine than the other 6. And we know cylinder 8 is a little worse than 7 from the coolant flow fiasco- the “balanced flow” is actually a MORE balanced then before- it isn’t a perfect 50/50. The temps get easily verified by working the engine hard then pull over and go use s digital temp gun- 8 is always the hottest.

If it isn’t, that temp gun shows it up at idle- and that’s because something is wrong somewhere. Then it gets even worse on turbo pickup engines because the turbo is on that bank so it cant shed heat as easy as the other side.

So taking all that into account- and when people want to onow which side should they put in the gauge that is telling them when something is TOO HOT be it egt or ect- which side should be done? The hotter side.

What if something goes haywire on the driver side whip driving and it start running 300° hotter all the sudden? Then something massive went wrong in one cylinder. If you are monitoring near the rear cylinder but the front one has the failure- that temp increase is really 500 not 300. So do you need 8, one for each cylinder?

On center mount engines we tap the manifold like 2” from rear cylinder yet only 6” from turbo. And honestly the driver side is so much easier to reach and has clearance of the dog house so normally hummer/hmmwv gets the driver side done. It really doesn’t matter. But hummer egt is higher than pickup egt because pickups often do it farther away from the exhaust valve. So what does 1100° mean vs 850°- first thing is how far away are you measuring. Basically you put it in wherever you choose and see what is “normal”. Then when you work it hard enough that you see the egt rise and stay up there a while- like towing a real heavy load, or a hummer guy in vegas who yesterday was climbing a long mountain road and overheated- you will see the egt up at level X and then after 60 seconds you see an increase in ect. This is a sign your egt is in the yellow zone. You back off the go pedal and the egt comes down 200° and the temp comes down a hair- you verified that is in the yellow. If you don’t see the temp coming down with it within a minute- that would be the red zone.

When the engine is working hard enough that the applied heat is more than the engine immediately reacts to- that is too strong for that engine.

Where do I wanna see two gauges of same manufacture so they read the same? Ect.
Unless you run the engine so insanely hard for like 3 minutes that you smoke exhaust valves- but it doesn’t over heat the coolant - egt will tell you nothing of critical information. The hotter the egt- the sooner you will crack the head between the valves. We know this. But what temperature is really the key? This info I have never heard.
I asked Bill Heath many years ago- using egt just behind rear cylinder valve how long ne would run at 1100°- his response “to the moon and back”. Everywhere I looked I couldn’t find any hard response on what temperature and where without everyone referring to they copied someone else’s opinion- but never found someone that said temperature X AND here is the proof why. So I had no problem running my optimizer at 1100-1200 often. What did Find? At 70,000 miles on my optimizer that was new 2004: some fine cracking started between some of the valves. I planned on adding the brass inserts “just in case”. But now it is a must if I run those heads. So really I am debating on selling my left arm to get p400 heads. But I have never seen 100,000 miles on a disassembled p400 to know they don’t crack anyways. It sure seams they made improvements for that problem- but that is honestly peoples best guess because we see they made a change- an attempt in improvement. But the military isn’t running p400 to 100,000 miles. The spec op hmmwvs, the Israel defense boats, etc that got p400s- those are units that get brand new tires every 5,000 miles ‘just in case’. So my guess / assumption is that at 20,000 miles or so- they will break in a new engine, transmission, xfer case ‘just in case” or for peak performance- like a race car.

The two dozen or so well off guys I met that are running p400 surely are not pulling heads to “see how it’s going”.

Idk who bought 3bals rv p400. I was sure trying to but couldn’t break away for a week because of family issues, and was planning on going to a casino to use a credit card to withdraw gambling cash for it was my finance plan. But I sure would like to know and if they would be willing to turn it into a side mount turbo- I would like to onow the money needed for getting the center mount heads, turbo, exhaust manifolds, etc. he did for that. But obviously we would see first the condition between the valves and could ask how many miles he ran that engine before the fire. And we could see if that many miles starts any cracking in the p400.
 
Will L. said:
Here’s the thing: you COULD have a cylinder on the left side running hotter than the right side. But you shouldn’t. We know cylinders 7&8 are the hottest, thats why they have slightly different specs in the engine than the other 6. And we know cylinder 8 is a little worse than 7 from the coolant flow fiasco- the “balanced flow” is actually a MORE balanced then before- it isn’t a perfect 50/50. The temps get easily verified by working the engine hard then pull over and go use s digital temp gun- 8 is always the hottest.

If it isn’t, that temp gun shows it up at idle- and that’s because something is wrong somewhere. Then it gets even worse on turbo pickup engines because the turbo is on that bank so it cant shed heat as easy as the other side.

So taking all that into account- and when people want to onow which side should they put in the gauge that is telling them when something is TOO HOT be it egt or ect- which side should be done? The hotter side.

What if something goes haywire on the driver side whip driving and it start running 300° hotter all the sudden? Then something massive went wrong in one cylinder. If you are monitoring near the rear cylinder but the front one has the failure- that temp increase is really 500 not 300. So do you need 8, one for each cylinder?

On center mount engines we tap the manifold like 2” from rear cylinder yet only 6” from turbo. And honestly the driver side is so much easier to reach and has clearance of the dog house so normally hummer/hmmwv gets the driver side done. It really doesn’t matter. But hummer egt is higher than pickup egt because pickups often do it farther away from the exhaust valve. So what does 1100° mean vs 850°- first thing is how far away are you measuring. Basically you put it in wherever you choose and see what is “normal”. Then when you work it hard enough that you see the egt rise and stay up there a while- like towing a real heavy load, or a hummer guy in vegas who yesterday was climbing a long mountain road and overheated- you will see the egt up at level X and then after 60 seconds you see an increase in ect. This is a sign your egt is in the yellow zone. You back off the go pedal and the egt comes down 200° and the temp comes down a hair- you verified that is in the yellow. If you don’t see the temp coming down with it within a minute- that would be the red zone.

When the engine is working hard enough that the applied heat is more than the engine immediately reacts to- that is too strong for that engine.

Where do I wanna see two gauges of same manufacture so they read the same? Ect.
Unless you run the engine so insanely hard for like 3 minutes that you smoke exhaust valves- but it doesn’t over heat the coolant - egt will tell you nothing of critical information. The hotter the egt- the sooner you will crack the head between the valves. We know this. But what temperature is really the key? This info I have never heard.
I asked Bill Heath many years ago- using egt just behind rear cylinder valve how long ne would run at 1100°- his response “to the moon and back”. Everywhere I looked I couldn’t find any hard response on what temperature and where without everyone referring to they copied someone else’s opinion- but never found someone that said temperature X AND here is the proof why. So I had no problem running my optimizer at 1100-1200 often. What did Find? At 70,000 miles on my optimizer that was new 2004: some fine cracking started between some of the valves. I planned on adding the brass inserts “just in case”. But now it is a must if I run those heads. So really I am debating on selling my left arm to get p400 heads. But I have never seen 100,000 miles on a disassembled p400 to know they don’t crack anyways. It sure seams they made improvements for that problem- but that is honestly peoples best guess because we see they made a change- an attempt in improvement. But the military isn’t running p400 to 100,000 miles. The spec op hmmwvs, the Israel defense boats, etc that got p400s- those are units that get brand new tires every 5,000 miles ‘just in case’. So my guess / assumption is that at 20,000 miles or so- they will break in a new engine, transmission, xfer case ‘just in case” or for peak performance- like a race car.

The two dozen or so well off guys I met that are running p400 surely are not pulling heads to “see how it’s going”.

Idk who bought 3bals rv p400. I was sure trying to but couldn’t break away for a week because of family issues, and was planning on going to a casino to use a credit card to withdraw gambling cash for it was my finance plan. But I sure would like to know and if they would be willing to turn it into a side mount turbo- I would like to onow the money needed for getting the center mount heads, turbo, exhaust manifolds, etc. he did for that. But obviously we would see first the condition between the valves and could ask how many miles he ran that engine before the fire. And we could see if that many miles starts any cracking in the p400.
Click to expand...
Yeah that’s what I told him, monitor the hot side, but he wanted dual and asked me to see if I could find something (in return for a 40lb roll of mig wire he gave me... lol)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top