• Welcome to The Truck Stop! We see you haven't REGISTERED yet.

    Your truck knowledge is missing!
    • Registration is FREE , all we need is your birthday and email. (We don't share ANY data with ANYONE)
    • We have tons of knowledge here for your diesel truck!
    • Post your own topics and reply to existing threads to help others out!
    • NO ADS! The site is fully functional and ad free!
    CLICK HERE TO REGISTER!

    Problems registering? Click here to contact us!

    Already registered, but need a PASSWORD RESET? CLICK HERE TO RESET YOUR PASSWORD!

computers belong on a desk not in a truck...

jessejames88

jessejames88

New Member
Messages
10
Reaction score
0
Location
ny
hi guys new here sorry to come in on a sour note...
but this weekend was the last straw went out to pick up an enclosed car trailer for my buddy and the transmission that was rebuilt a week ago kept going into limp mode 2nd gear finally get there and shut the truck off and now it wont restart hot... ip has less the 5k ona brand new stanadyne i think its the optical sensor... i must say i had enough of computers... limp mode no starts, the truck has beaten me... too much work and $$ not enough power and reliability... so i have a db2 pump i want to swap in... i think i need 6.2/mech 6.5 injector lines to go with the pump? and a cable style pedal, will a pedal from a gasser work? i plan on going full manual on the 4l80e also... i can live with all of that and kinda prefer to feel my and control my shifts to have a truck i dont have hook to my laptop on a weekly basis... anything else you guys think i might need?? at least with no computer it will be emp proof! thanks for any help...
 
sound like you need my parts!! How about just a trans computer they are not so bad so long as they have power and ground. Oh yeah sorry to hear of your troubles I know what its like after I cooled off I stuck with my ds4!!
 
jessejames88 said:
hi guys new here sorry to come in on a sour note...
but this weekend was the last straw went out to pick up an enclosed car trailer for my buddy and the transmission that was rebuilt a week ago kept going into limp mode 2nd gear finally get there and shut the truck off and now it wont restart hot... ip has less the 5k ona brand new stanadyne i think its the optical sensor... i must say i had enough of computers... limp mode no starts, the truck has beaten me... too much work and $$ not enough power and reliability... so i have a db2 pump i want to swap in... i think i need 6.2/mech 6.5 injector lines to go with the pump? and a cable style pedal, will a pedal from a gasser work? i plan on going full manual on the 4l80e also... i can live with all of that and kinda prefer to feel my and control my shifts to have a truck i dont have hook to my laptop on a weekly basis... anything else you guys think i might need?? at least with no computer it will be emp proof! thanks for any help...
Click to expand...

There's at least one guy on the board who's swapped to a DB2. Do a search and it should show up.

Seems to me, if you want to go non-computer controlled on the engine and trans you might as well sell the truck and get an earlier model of the GMT-400 chassis....

Have you even checked for codes?

It could be a simple fix, replacing an optical sensor is most likley a lot easier (and cheaper) than converting to a db2.

Computers are not the evil in the machine, when you figure out how to use them/work with them, they're actually a huge benefit...
 
Last edited:
It take a little bit of understanding circuits to maintain a 6.5. Being handy with a multimeter, etc...I honestly have had no real issues other than a single no start, replaced IP. It sounds like you are guessing on the issue which can lead to parts swapping and frustration without diagnosing the problem. And of course you cant even pay people to diagnose it, because the professionals are incompetent too, they just happen to have a manual that tells them to do a step, which for the 6.5 was not enough. I love working on this truck, it works great.

Of course there are common things every 6.5 owner should know, lubricating fuel properly, draining water/checking lift pump (LP) pressure, relocating PMD, etc...in order to keep the Injection Pump (IP) happy.
 
Member bobbiemartin wrote a book on the conversion to a mechanical ip. I don't think manual control of the tranny is a great idea. The ecm/pcm help prevent self distruction in the tranny.
As far as mechanical verses electronic, I have both. It's all in knowing how to deal with what you have. Both can work great. Electronic has more tunability.
 
pmd relocated, lift pump pressure 5-6 psi @ idle... drained fuel manager to glass jar, no signs of water and i've been using 2 stroke oil to lubricate clear hose on return, no bubbles, checked for codes with scan tech none current, just historical trans codes... swapped the pmd for the brand new stanadyne from my new ip (never used it cause my relocated one was still good) i have a good mech pump i got from work off the old service truck... the lines i found for $46 delivered... and i'm sure i could scrounge up a pedal from the local junk yard pretty cheap... heard lmc sells the throttle cable not sure how much though so for under $100 i can "relocate my pmd to the trash can" sell my chip online and maybe my ds4... turn up the db2 and probably run as good if not better than i am now...
 
I had a '93 6.2 mechanical pump and more recently a 5.7 gaser with a cable... personally, I wouldn't take either if given a choice! Pedal effort sucks compared to the electronic 6.5. If you haven't felt the pedal in one of those mechanical rides, you may want to think about it, and maybe drive one b4 you go head long into converting. Just my humble opinion. Good luck either way you go.
 
The electronic pedals have zero feel. Gassers have a load you can feel in the pedal from the intake manifold vacuum causing more load and friction on the throttle shaft, TBI included. Higher vacuum the harder it can be to move the pedal. With cables you can feel to the point of knowing where she is going to shift.

Electronic, well, the computer does as it damn well pleases regardless of where you put your foot. The most modern computer controlled junk is "I am sorry Dave, I can't release the throttle now." Just ask Toyota Owners, 2007+ Trailblazer SS owners, or 6.5 PMD owners with the rare surge to WOT PMD failure. Granted a cable can stick, but, the return to idle when you want it to is ignored in modern computers by ignorant programmers with low emissions goals.
 
Well, you can keep your cables. I wouldn't have another in my garage if I didn't have to.

My '02 Jetta TDI would go to idle if you held the brake and throttle for more than a couple seconds. I found that out while riding the brake and spooling things up to make a quick left hand turn. Ooops, didn't do that twice.

As for the 6.5L electronic pedal... I've had a few hickups, but the redundancy always took it to idle. Gives you plenty of time to get a new one. Let see, I'm on my second pedal in 327k miles. I'd have to look back to see when the first one gave up. Not a mission disabling failure, not a wot deal either, just a hickup. I usually don't give something a second chance to dick with me.

I am curious if someone knows the facts around the possible failure modes of the app on the 6.5 and what the program does. I know there are three signals that have to jive to make the app work.

As for the shifting... My Kennedy Diesel program likes to stay in the taller gear, I don't have any problem grabbing the lever to choose a downshift if I'd like one.

In the stock trim, I found it easier to charge the hills to avoid the "computer downshift" but don't have to do that anymore.
 
Last edited:
I dunno, the 6.5 is the first drive by wire throttle I've had.

I like it so far, feels pretty much like a normal throttle with lighter springs on it.

Response is "snappy" and immediate, both on and off the throttle. More so than any cable throttle I've driven....and I've driven a lot. Everything from mundane dailies to 600 and 700 HP high effort throttles.

I'd also say it's probably the best cruise control I've ever had. Smooth, quiet and responsive. No doubt a side benefit of drive by wire.

Technology is not always something to be feared.......
 
great white said:
Technology is not always something to be feared.......
Click to expand...

Not technology's fault.

Like HAL, the computers have to go through the EPA, government' regs, bean counters, and large corporations. Easy to deny a problem and the gov't usually looks the other way for a while till bodies start to get piled too high. Just ask Toyota owners about something the big three have been through time and time again. Throttle sticking for whatever reason.

You can hold fuel back till the turbo spools with electronics for emissions. (Cummings did this mechanically.)

But slap a cable to the floor and you have WOT no questions asked. (Except for mechanical limiters.) Release the throttle and you have only a dashpot to stop the throttle return.

Enter the EPA filled computer. Designed by a team that the number 1 goal is emissions then MPG. Figure a bean counter factor and limited time for each model year and emissions change.

Figure the cost to correct a mistake. Cheaper to ignore it.

Then figure what a mistake in the computer can do - hold the throttle open. WOT, half throttle etc. I deal with this every day on my other ride - refuse to always return to idle. Not predictable either. But limited production and GM to bury the problem...

So aside of the numb feel and the hesitation the computer has with drive by wire... I put up with the unpredictable throttle applied when I am standing on the brakes.

So the drive by wire is the worst idea they have come up simply by bad implementation.

A sticky cable can be fixed. It is a real pain in the butt to fix a buggy computer, esp with the new stability controls also getting in the way/mix.
 
update, well truck went back to the transmission shop; high gear clutch drum was bad. and now shifts like a champ even loaded, nice and firm.... parked the truck at home depot came out, no start... popped the hood, and i had a decent size bubble in the return line... ok its getting air, but no fuel leaks?? i have a feeling it is the line from the tank to the lp. it is rusty in one spot and may be pourus enough to suck air but not leak... we'll see...
 
NoDak said:
I had a '93 6.2 mechanical pump and more recently a 5.7 gaser with a cable... personally, I wouldn't take either if given a choice! Pedal effort sucks compared to the electronic 6.5. If you haven't felt the pedal in one of those mechanical rides, you may want to think about it, and maybe drive one b4 you go head long into converting. Just my humble opinion. Good luck either way you go.
Click to expand...

I have a Suburban that came with a DS4 and has had a DB2 for some time now. Throttle pedal effort was maybe a bit higher when I had a fabricated throttle cable bracket when running twin thermostats and a DB2. I now have a single thermostat and the factory throttle cable bracket and its not bad at all. My wife is the primary driver and she has no complaints. Same vehicle also went through two teenage girls learning to drive and they seemed to manage OK with it. I wouldn't say its objectionable or excessively difficult to press the throttle. Plus its kind of nice knowing it will go when you floor it, no stumble, no stalling, just running like it should.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top