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All new steering linkage but still something funky going on...

treegump

Romans 3:22-24
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Location
Martinsville, IN
I replaced my inner & outer tie rods (moog), centerlink (raybestos), pitman arm (moog), idler arm (moog), and idler arm bracket (moog) & steering stabilizer (oreilly rancho). It felt good and tight when I left the shop that (Sunday) night. (Even though the truck hadn't been aligned yet.) It sat for a (Mon)day, and then a friend picked it up Monday night and drove it home. He said when he drove it today (Tuesday), before & after the alignment, the front seemed really bouncy, as if the shocks (Monroe Reflex) had gone bad (overnight!?!). I noticed the same thing when I drove it - super bouncy. Also, the steering, though straight (and camber straight too), still feels really loose. There is play in the steering gear box, but why would it feel tight before the alignment? Would the front tires toed-in by a less than an inch really make it feel that tight? Any thoughts?

As far as the bounce. If the A-arms are fully stretched the shocks are fully stretched out. Could the shocks have gone bad since the front end was fully stretched for a day and a half while I was working on the front end?

Also, I forgot to freeze the outer tierod ball joints so they'd slide into steering knuckles, so they were super difficult to get in. The castle nuts didn't go on far enough to fit the cotter pins in so I put blue lock-tite on temporarily, and after a few days I'll stick the 1/2" impact gun back on them and put red lock-tite on them. Since the tie-rods are hardened steel I can't (or could barely) drill new holes.

(This is a break from my "I just bought an LLY" post)
 
Shouldn't have to use loc-tite. The taper does the work, which sounds like the problem. Are the tie rods through the knuckle from the correct side?

Compare your new and old pitman and idler closely. I've seen one with a different angle installed in error and it put ALL KINDS of bump steer in the suspension. Made it feel like a bad shock, rode really funky, didn't handle for crap.
 
I think he is reffering to the the threads only because he can't get cotter pin in wants to loctite threads for insurance.

I'd see why cotter pin can't line up mistake in drill through position or taper seating problem.

Is a ball joint bad that it was aligned then and shifted slightly and alignment is incorrect now?

If shocks were not correct size travel wise and you hung from them yeah I can see that ruining them. Are they leaking? Can you make the bumper bounce by hand excessively?
 
Me thinks 3500GMC is on to something... Go over the parts and make sure they are the correct ones for the application and they are in the correct locations/positions. RTFM also, there might be a gotcha in there. I have been bit by more than one pimply faced counter kid at the parts store. Even had a stealer install the steering linkage on a Astro van swapped side to side. That thing was almost dangerous to drive.

Do the worst wrench spinners wind up at dealer shops? If so why?
 
I'll post pictures when I get back to the apartment but thought I'd reply to the thoughts. I pulled the old parts out of the scrap metal pile and compared them to the new, installed parts. They look differently shaped as far as widths and depths but as far as the 2 points of connection, they appeared to be the same place at the same distance. (because moog is different than stock.)

The outer tie rods are the same tapered depth-I checked when I installed them. Stock nuts that held the stock outer tie rods in were locking nuts and not castle nuts. So, I used emery cloth on both the new tapered surfaces and the knuckle holes. I then used a ball joint installer (c-clamp looking tool) and 1/2" impact driver to install the new tie rods into the knuckles. They are TIGHT. Then I applied the blue lock tite and castle nut since the old lock nuts didn't work and I couldn't get the cotter pins in the new castle nuts. I checked them tonight and reinstalled the nuts with red lock tite.

Center link or the center bar is the same as far as distance between holes. So it's not that.

I only was able to check the driver's side shock absorber and it felt just as new as when I installed it.

The truck doesn't bounce excessively after all the bumps either. Just seemingly random. I hit bumps on purpose and nothing... It steers straight and the steering stabilizer seems to work. Not as good as my busted one, but seems to work... Could it all be from a bad gear box? My tires were a bit...the top leaned in and the bottom leaned out, from cranking the torsion bars I believe. Could I have just gotten so used to the tires not aligned that it feels weird aligned? :-/ (I wouldn't think so, since I drive other vehicles.)
 
Oh, and I ordered everything off of auto barn. So it wouldn't have been a counter kid's fault. The only thing I guess I could have done...I have the centerlink installed with the grease fittings facing down. :-(. I believe I have the longest part of the centerlink is facing the front... If I have to flip that, it'll mean another alignment. :-(. CRAP!!!! (if I installed it wrong)
 
I checked the centerlink of my friend's Chevy 1500HD and mine is the same as his - direction wise.

This is the pitman arm. If you look closely you can see the tip of my finger (~1/2") between the pitman arm and the gear box. I tightened her as much as I could.
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Parts comparisons: old vs new
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Now this is weird, but is it normal??? I pulled the truck in straight. Tires were straight and parallel with each other when I parked it. When I jacked up one side, the tire will turn out, but the other tire will stay straight. Set it down and it'll straighten up but not completely parallel with the opposite side. Jacked up the other side and it'll turn out a little bit and setting it down it'll do the same. After jacking both up and letting both down, the tires were \/ a little bit but when I backed her up, they were straight up & down & parallel with each other. The tires were also tight - ball joints & wheel bearings feel good - no movement at all.
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Brand new a/t load c tires-came on the truck when I bought her.

Also, the random excessive bouncing seems to happen when both tires hit the bump at the same time.
 
Check your torsion keys. Maybe you broke one.

That actually would make sense with the symptoms, I think. (you know, if I have my head wrapped around the mechanics of the truck...). Is this a "common" problem with trucks with cranked torsion bars? Is that why after market leveling keys are sold?
 
I don't think it happens very frequently. Aftermarket keys are just to give more adjustment than stock. The spline is clocked some to allow that. IIRC the 1500 ones are what are called 'green keys' and work as "clocked".
Your shocks shouldn't be operating topped out. You should have extended ones, extenders, or spacers like the ones in an album of mine. Here
 
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Yeah thinking slight difference in parts makes a lot of sense.

I'd lay under truck and have someone turn lock to lock a couple of times to see what is happening. I'd look for the center link to travel in a arc same as the pitman arc. It should stay parallel with front bumper. And the idler should be tracking true with the pitman. It sounds like the idler and pitman arm are a different length / geometry.

Such that it is fighting a little arc movement and builds toe error on passenger side. I bet error in arc causes passenger side front wheels to wobble. When I drive with bushhog fast and the tail wheel wobbles it kinda bounces.

While stationary you could align it and if stays on the correct side of arc for aligned toe it probably drives pretty good like normal in a straight line.

I had an '88 GMC S-15 that I think I busted something with torsion key or adjustment of key (I can't remember and didn't know much or care to fix it ) and any way I remember it clunking/thumping and making a noise over bigger bumps.
 
Nah I guess you'd feel that in the steering wheel as a shimmy.

Do you feel anything in the steering while its happening or is it just loose? Does the truck wander with ruts or anything else besides being bouncy?

Maybe torsion bar related.
 
Just checked the torsion keys and bolts and they look fine. Doesn't appear to have any noticeable cracks or anything. And unless the old steering linkage was installed incorrectly, I'd say the new is installed as it should be.

When I get a chance, I'll have someone turn the steering while I'm under and see what I can. I...don't think there's a shimmy. It just feels loose... And there isn't any wandering when I hit bumps, but then again, I don't exactly let go of my steering wheel when I hit bumps either, haha. I don't have to fight my steering to keep it straight.

Mike - I don't see the spacer in the picture, but I plan on putting either a nut or bunch up a few washers to get the slack out of the shocks. My rubber washers/spacers will be too big than, so I think I'll cut the top one in half so I can get the locking nut back on.
 
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