AirDog 100 Lift Pump Help

[SethRoush97_6_5]

Looking to add an AirDog 100 lift pump. The question I have is would it replace the stock size pump I have now or would it be an add on like guys do with fass fuel systems? I've also heard things about about being able to do away with the fuel bowl. Any help with this would be greatly appreciated. I know some of the things I wanna do might be pushing the limits on a 6.5, but it's no fun when you done break things from time to time

 

[SnowDrift]

Your fuel bowl is also your fuel heater, so you may not want to delete this.

 

[Will L.]

Nice hot thin fuel goes through the ip much better.

 

[Twisted Steel Performance]

Yes, it will replace the stock pump, and yes you can remove & replace the stock FFM, filter can/bowl... BUT you will need to install another filter assembly of your choosing. The air dog is way overkill for even the heaviest modded 6.x, but it's what ever you want.

 

[WarWagon]

Sell the Airdog and get a different cheaper setup and have some cash leftover. Unless the Airdog is "flow on fail" you are causing problems rather than helping anything. Noise from the insane pump is unnecessary to have to put up with on the 6.5.

I would suggest a Walbro (flow on fail), eliminate tank sock, prefilter before lift pump with fuel heater, and keep the FFM as the final filter.

Note the fuel heater needs to be before any filters/screens, etc. Pumps don't need heaters. Filters plug from gelling fuel first.

The IP will suck fuel through a failed lift pump if it will allow it. Loss of power, but, you get home. Relay goes out or motor fails on some pumps you get no flow and the engine quits 5 seconds later. Been there done that have the tow bills that cost more than the exotic pump. Nevermind the excitement from going from the fast lane to the side of the road with no engine power.

 

[SnowDrift]

Ah, yeah, I forgot that was the deal killer with me when I bought the Walbro from Leroy a few months back - Airdog sounds much smoother and was my first choice, too, over stock, but a non-flow on fail doesn't get me home.

 

[SethRoush97_6_5]

so you guys are more against the airdog. whatt do you all say about the rapter 100 that leroy has?

 

[Twisted Steel Performance]

I can't help but ask... why do you need another LP, I understand a upgrade but if you don't have a fuel psi gauge your just spending, make sure you need it... good money could go to a better place first maybe.. just saying....

 

[Will L.]

All said above, but more questiony...

On LP that isn't flow on fail, cutting incoming fuel before stopping outgoing fuel by way of fso can chatter the ip a bit. On my hopped up db2 (s) it did some damage, but the new pumps weren't around in 20 years ago. What we did was added a stock pump as a second circuit with a one way valve to stop the big LP from pushing into the little LP and loosing juice. Those deadheaded stock LP didn't last but 6months, but who cares compared to price of an ip, or complete dying engine.

Who built your ip? What pressures and volume did they set the pump to? Is your ip stock, and if so- what is your idle and max rpm pressures?
Have you enlarged your inlet port? How about enlarged return (doubtful on a ds4)? For the stock LP, are you using ep158, and are you getting full power to it?

While I'm on a tyrant-not just you but everyone- how many of you realize the pump, any pump will last dramatically longer and perform better when it is pushing instead of sucking. Closer to the tank is best for pumps- they are "pumps" not "suckers".

 

[Burning oil]

The walbro FRC10 is a great mod for 99% of the DS4 trucks and a lot cheaper than Raptor or AirDog.
Fuel PSI gauge is the most useful gauge IMO.
With any LP you should really be powering it up with a LP relay harness too. The stock system will keep LP from its potential and they die early because of it.

 

[WarWagon]

Just throwing it out there what happens with different lift pump designs. The raptor 100 is a Gerotor pump and will not flow on fail. I ran the sister brand Mallory. When the brushes failed in the motor at like 15K on the Mallory it came home on the hook. Also had a seal failure on the Mallory I caught early. New brushes in the motor and a wire fell off the relay - another hook bill. Not saying the other pump has these issues, but, they both have brushes and seals at different lifespans. IMO they are a fairly quiet pump compared to others like roller vane etc.

It would be the pump I would use if I felt I needed more fuel just because it is the quietest of all the pumps I have used except the factory plunger types. IMO the AirDog is overkill these engines just don't care about.

Mods you will feel vs. a lift pump:

Start with a 4" exhaust and hot tune. Remove the fender intake snorkel if it has one as that is restrictive. Cooling system upgrades are a good thing to look at. Then add a better turbo. If you have funds left stall the thing with a 2400 RPM Yank. That's the brake stand burnout arena. I do this with a Walbro lift pump. Not bulletproof, but, lasted longer than ANY other lift pump I tried and I have a grave yard of them including Walbro killed on bad fuel.

 

[SnowDrift]

...and this, above, from WarWagon is why I usually look through his posts when I'm wondering about longevity and reliability items for the 6.5. I don't use my truck as often as he does, but when I do need it, I NEED it.

If the LP doesn't flow on fail, then I have a $60 part that can cost me $300-600 if I have to call a hook - or more if I'm loaded. With a flow on fail pump, the worst I need to do is get a full tank of fuel and it doesn't know the difference.

The worst thing I have found about the Walbro is the sound it emits. It's less noticeable after the engine is running, but I find myself looking around to see if anyone is looking when I start up in a public place - It sounds kind of comical, in my opinion.

 

[Quadstar Tuning LLC]

I just replaced my entire fuel system from the tank sender outlet to the IP for under $300 by shopping around. The FASS isn't as much overkill as the Raptor 100.

Ever since I started tuning it more aggressively last year, the '93 style lift pump would zero out all the time.

I retained the heater and WIF as well

Here's my flow on fail...carry two cheap adjustable wrenches and a $2 fitting. The filter has a primer button and air bleed built into it:

 

[NVW]

I would put a bypass loop with a good ball valve, it would be quicker and cleaner on the roadside.

 

[Quadstar Tuning LLC]

I would put a bypass loop with a good ball valve, it would be quicker and cleaner on the roadside.

Yea you could install however you want. It's just pushlok hose with JIC fittings. Not really a concern with how much I drive it though.

 

[Paveltolz]

I run the Air Dog DF-165 so my comments should be referenced to that unit. After all was said and done in my build (Air Dog starts with post 156) the Walbro FRB-5 with an in-line filter set up was more than sufficient for my needs on the old motor and I doubt my current motor would have proved different.
In defense of the DF-165, I had an issue with the relay and would frequently and unexpectedly end up with a non-running pump but not a non-running truck. It would re-start as well after sitting for the day in the parking lot. So, from my experience, the pump appears to be 'flow on fail' though I can't assume the same for the DF-100.
Yes, the pump is noisy when running prior to start up, the noise of the motor post ignition meant that there was nothing noteworthy, to me, of the noise of the pump. However, that is a purely subjective observation.
I removed the FFM and haven't had an issue with cold fuel start ups in the winter and the truck sat outside with only the stock block heater. One must judge their needs based on the climate where they are though.

 

[Quadstar Tuning LLC]

FWIW, the fuel heater is to aid in water separation and usually only exists in filter housings that double as water separators. They don't have amperage to noticeably heat the fuel. I monitor fuel temps with data logging and the temps don't rise noticeably until the motor and IP are warmed up.

 

[Will L.]

Paveltolz, we know your truck drinks some fuel when squishing the skinny pedal. It's nice having a 6.5 that beats up gassers! I didnt know yours was good on that- cool. Loud pumps never bother me.

How hot does the FFM heater get the fuel? In refineries and at our plastics to fuel plant, 195 f is the magic number. Infact, the tank that feeds into out water separator is refered to as the "195 tank".

Unlike myth busters I'll tell you to try this at home. Measure out a cup of diesel and a cup of water. Mix it together good and use a liquid thermometer. Descent heat gun will get you there in a 1/2 gallon pot your wife doesn't like anymore.

Hot diesel atomizes better, but is more susceptible to the bubble monster. Plastic fuel tanks don't like it either, but the injectors sure do.

 

[WarWagon]

I just replaced my entire fuel system from the tank sender outlet to the IP for under $300 by shopping around. The FASS isn't as much overkill as the Raptor 100.

Ever since I started tuning it more aggressively last year, the '93 style lift pump would zero out all the time.

I retained the heater and WIF as well

Here's my flow on fail...carry two cheap adjustable wrenches and a $2 fitting. The filter has a primer button and air bleed built into it:

Simply have to take my hat off to the idea of using the better Duramax filter setup on a 6.x rig. Heater and all included. All the heater has to do is keep the fuel from wax crystal plugging the filter. This injection system doesn't need the best filtration. You can do better on water separation than the OEM filters with a separate dedicated water separator.

To nit pick: Don't use brass colored metal in the fuel system. It's not compatible with Biodiesel and will turn green/corrode. Eventually you get that coming loose going through the IP. Yes, a lot of states are dumping Bio in diesel and don't have to label below 5%.

I found that IF the lift pump will spin on it's own you get reduced power. However big fuel demand will literally vapor lock the IP as diesel boils in the fuel line from the dead pumps restriction. High RPM alone due to the large amount of fuel returned can cause the vapor lock with light throttle. So even if the pump will spin it can be so restrictive you vapor lock and stall out. The Mallory would do this to me.

If the lift pumps locks up completely you are done.

 

[Quadstar Tuning LLC]

Thank you for the good feedback. I'll look into replacing the 2 brass hose ends I have after the primary filter. Would be a real cheap switch to stainless for two -6 barbs