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A discussion on the "why" of intercoolers.

great white

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Why an Intercooler makes a difference

(Disclaimer; for the “Bill Nye science guy” types who loves to poke holes in everything- this is very simplified so go easy OK?)

We all know what an intercooler is and we all know it reduces temperature of the air charge. But why does it work? That’s and easy answer isn’t it?

It makes the air more dense.

Well, let’s talk about that a bit and see if we can’t gain a bit more than that rudimentary understanding….

First, some theory and definitions.

Definitions and resources;

PSIG = PSI gauge. This is gauge pressure displayed over 14.7 psi (1 atmosphere)

PSIA = PSI absolute. This is the pressure your engine actually sees. Boost plus 1 atmosphere if you prefer.

Pressure altitude (PA) = pressure altitude is the indicated altitude when an altimeter is set to a pressure setting. Standard is when set at 29.92 in/mg, and then adjusted for pressure of the day to give aircraft a representative value for altitude above sea level. Can be thought of as “altitude above sea level” once the correction factor for the day is added.

Density altitude (DA) = without getting too wordy, it’s how “thick” the air is. Temperature and humidity affect this value. Hotter is thinner, more humid is less dense.

Standard ICAO day = 29.92 in/mg at 15 Celsius.

Atmosphere is always 21% oxygen. That never changes. In a NA, supercharged or turbo engine, you never get more than 21% O2 in there. What you do with a turbo is shove more atmospheres in so you get more oxygen per volume, not %. Think about it a bit, it’ll start making sense.

Online DA Calculator - http://wahiduddin.net/calc/calc_da_rh.htm

Altitude chart - http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/air-altitude-pressure-d_462.html

Theory;

Engines don’t really care about pressure altitude, or what you see on the road sign; they only “see” density altitude. Whether you’re talking axial flow or centrifugal jet engines or reciprocating assemblies, an engine only cares about how much air it can pull (or in our case, blow) in during a set period of time.
(Well, all engines actually “blow” air into the cylinders, but that another discussion for another time)

That’s density.

In aircraft speak, it’s called density altitude and affects everything from lift to engine performance.

Now, density altitude is affected by a couple factors. Temperature is a big one. So is in/mg and humidity.

Let’s only look at temperature since that’s easier for us to get our heads around in an automotive application.

15 degrees Celsius and 29.92 in/mg is considered an ICAO standard day. For arguments sake, that’s what we’ll start with and 50% humidity.

Now, you’re rolling along by the ocean at 0 feet ASL and boosting your 10 psi because you’ve got your foot into it. It’s a pleasant day and the scenery is going by at a high rate of knots. Or, you’re rolling up the coast, sea breezes are blowing, sun’s out and have a hill to climb so your foot is “in to it”.

Life’s good.

Let’s say its 15 c outside the IAT at 10 psi is 140c. Humidity is hanging right around 50%. Not unrealistic numbers.

So, what’s the density altitude our engine is seeing?

A couple quick calculations later and you get 6124 feet.

Holy crap! My engine thinks it’s at 6124 feet but I’m staring at the ocean out my window!

So let’s move on to how this affects boost. (This is going to get a bit trickier to follow because we're jumping back and forth from density to pressure)

You’re making 10 psig. But what does the engine see in absolute?

Logic says to add 14.7 psi right? That’s 24.7 psia.

Hold on a second now. Your engine thinks it’s at 6000 feet remember?

Pressure at 6124 feet is around 11.3 psi. So you’re really boosting to 21.3 psia.

What the heck? I want my 3 lbs back!

So, let’s drop an intercooler into the equation taking the same variables except for temperature.

Let’s say, with a 15c (59F) outside air temp and 140f IAT we get a delta of 40F. A reduction in our IAT from 140f to 100f.

What does that do?

A quick whip through the Jeppson calculator says the engine now sees 2991 feet.

Wow!

A 40F IAT drop more than halved the density altitude.

What does this mean for our boost?

3000 feet shows 13.2 PSIA, so now our boost number is 23.2 psia.

Much closer to what can be had at ICAO and we grabbed 2 psia back from The Reaper.

Your gauge will still show 10 psi, but your engine sees a very different psia.

Add in altitude above sea level and things get even more wonky.

Lets look at 3000 ft on an ICAO day with our other variables the same.

3000 ft at 140 IAT = 9810 feet DA! Yipes!

That’s 20.1 psia now. Crap, 4 psia is just gone….

3000 ft at 100IAT = 6658 ft. Still yipes, but better than almost 10,000 ft DA and now our engine sees 21.8 psia. Not a huge difference at these altitudes, but significant enough.

So you can see how lowering your IAT’s can reap big benefits.

This is why an intercooler might give more power, as can a water injection system except that introduces the variable “humidity” into the equation.

Intercooling allows you to cram more air (density, remember) in the cylinder per “blow”.

Now, you need the fuel in order to take advantage of that added density as well….but that’s another story with our trucks….

So, what’s all this mean for our intercooler theory discussion at the bottom line?

It makes the air more dense……;)
 
:pokey:
But the bottom line is (lord is that overused) and this may have been answered in the past, what do you get if you added an appropriately sized inter cooler to a 6.5? Assuming you added fuel and changed no other hardware (turbo). A pile of oily parts in the road? :hihi: The inter-cooler does have the potential to give you 'free' power.
 
:pokey:
But the bottom line is (lord is that overused) and this may have been answered in the past, what do you get if you added an appropriately sized inter cooler to a 6.5? Assuming you added fuel and changed no other hardware (turbo). A pile of oily parts in the road? :hihi: The inter-cooler does have the potential to give you 'free' power.

"The Page" has your answer there.....
 
Great info! Now lets say turbo psi is 10, when you add the intercooler the charge air drops in temp and density increases and pressure tends to drop also. Does more density put more strain the on the engine? such as the bottom end? If you calculate it like you have been adding the atmosphere pressure and boost pressure together you would say yes. But is this really true?
If so that means don't buy a 6.5/6.2 at sea level unless you want a cracked block hahaha:eek:

Either way I plan to intercool my truck with water to air...after I replace cracked heads again
 
IIRC, didn't Turbine Doc ditch his intercooler after he added the ATT? Again, iirc, he did this because the att was more efficient and no longer needed it? Don't recall all the surounding ins and outs on this though.
 
IIRC, didn't Turbine Doc ditch his intercooler after he added the ATT? Again, iirc, he did this because the att was more efficient and no longer needed it? Don't recall all the surounding ins and outs on this though.

Yup, he did.

Has to do with the mass of atmosphere moved.

More air mass at a lower pressure = less compression heating = more o2 in cylinder.

That's very over simplified, but in a nutshell...
 
Did he ditch the intercooler because he couldn't build the boost or just because he couldn't see (on the gauge) the corrected moles due to the temp reduction of the air from the IC...?

Don't know, you'd have to ask him.

I believe his reason was it was no longer needed for IAT's so the plumbing was simplified to turbo-intake instead of turbo-ATA-intake.
 
I believe Tim posted in several threads why he ditched the ATA. IIRC lower EGT's and IAT's, he no longer felt it was needed.
 
Great info! Now lets say turbo psi is 10, when you add the intercooler the charge air drops in temp and density increases and pressure tends to drop also. Does more density put more strain the on the engine? such as the bottom end? If you calculate it like you have been adding the atmosphere pressure and boost pressure together you would say yes. But is this really true?
If so that means don't buy a 6.5/6.2 at sea level unless you want a cracked block hahaha:eek:

Either way I plan to intercool my truck with water to air...after I replace cracked heads again

I noticed the avatar photo of your pickup and that you're running a Holset HE351VE turbo. That isn't by chance you and your buddy's vehicles I saw in the Reader's Rides section of Diesel Power a few months back, is it?
 
ha yes it is, I really need to hit the dyno but Id still like to do some things. Along with replace my currently cracked heads lol
 
Awaiting replacing both on my '94 C2500 come warm weather. Cracks between the valve seats on #'s 3&5 and #'s 4, 6&8! Was ok running back home on the interstate, but once I hit town, would dump 2 gallons out the tail pipe sitting at a stoplight! Took eight gallons of water to make it back home from Omaha when it started overheating that day. Going to upgrade the cooling system to '97+ specs, then sell it. My '98 K2500 Burb is the new toy. I would like to know how your VGT turbos work out, both as to controller function of the variable geometry to how they perform at lower rpm's (idle to 2200) for torque and mpg's. I have that issue and your pics marked, been subscribing to DP since issue #2 year 1. Been disappointed how they always start an article series on 6.5's, then neve go beyond part one. The exception seems to be the 5.9 powered Doomsday Suburban, but that's a Cummins repop. Dave Kennedy didn't even finish his series on dropping a built 6.5 into his 6.2 K10 Blazer with a GEPP custom 6.5. Disappointing.
 
I agree if they ever come up they always end without any positive feedback. I can't tell you what its like with rpm range because I don't have a tach but I can tell you it probably spools just as quick as a gm-8 because the exhaust housing constricts to a small size (smaller then the gm-8) then expands. right now mine is set up with manifold pressure controlled waste gate actuator. Id really like to get a powerstroke waste gate actuator as I think it will be stronger, or maybe my turbo just keeps binding as its old or something who knows lol. Im getting 16 mpg right now (winter fuel) Im hoping to see 18+ in the summer although I might not as my turbo isn't opening up all the way and Id also like to find an electric solenoid so I can open it all the way on the highway with a switch
 
Sounds like you've got some fun ahead of you, and also need to get gauges/tach. Let me know how it all shakes out, as I'm looking to do something other than the GM-8 on my Burb, and am looking for good bottom end so I can cruise Interstate out here at 1900-2000 rpm and 82 mph and get 20+ mpg.
 
I have gauges everything besides a tach ha i just don't care to have one. 20mpg at 82mph?! get like an hx 52 for that lol
 
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