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PMD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
- Thread starter trapp2012
- Start date
JMJNet
Recruit
It depends, do you have the classic PMD symptoms? Like stalling, etc.
- Staff
- #3
Run threw the checklist and post the results on here. It will help us help you!
Year: __2000____
- Truck model and class (ie: c2500) _____k3500____
- Automatic or Standard ____auto______
- Mileage: (indicate miles or km) _107k________
- Replaced parts and mods (IP, PMD, chip/PCM, TM, injectors etc) _______Nope just oil and air filt____
- Model: ‘S’ or ‘F’ engine, NA or Turbo, EGR? ___F___________
- Ambient outside temp: (indicate *C or *F) __________
- What fuel are you using? (#1 Diesel, #2 Diesel, Bio, VO, WVO, etc) ______Ultra low sulf___
- What fuel additives are you using? __Sulfer boost_________
- Where are you located? _______Youngstown area Of Ohio______
General maintenance: inspect and evaluate the condition of each. When were they last changed?
- Air filter _last yr________
- Fuel filter _last month________
- CDR Valve? __IDK_______
- Coolant – last flushed/replaced at _IDK____________
- Oil – synthetic/regular, changed at __Place purchaced at_________
- Batteries – state of charge, (matched set) replaced at __Duralast___________
- Battery cables and grounds (removed, cleaned and tightened): ___tightened___________
- Glow Plugs - how many miles on them? ___Stock______ What type? _________Stock____
- Injectors - last changed at __Stock_____________
History: (Describe how the problem first appeared.)
- What were you doing when it happened? _______Doesn't work_______
- How was the truck running fine before this problem appeared? _______Yes______
- Has this problem ever happened before? __apparently it doesn't work_____________________
- Describe any related factors that might be part of the problem. __________No over head lights____
- Have you checked for DTC (Diagnostic Trouble Codes)? (Y.N) _N___ And? ___N_____
Diagnostics:
1] Starting:
1a] Does the engine start? ______N___
1b] Does the engine crank over? _Y_______
1c] Are your batteries fully charged? __Y_______
1d] Have you removed, cleaned, and tightened all battery connections? ______Y__
1e] Does your Wait to Start light come on for a time? How long? _Y 10 sec ________
1f] Does your glow plug light come on? _______Y__ For how long? __10 sec_______
1g] Do you see smoke from the exhaust while cranking? What color? _____normal___
2] Fuel Issues (if not running):
2a] Can you hear your lift pump working? ____________
2b] Do you get a steady flow of fuel from the water drain (T-handle) ? _________
2c] Loosen the inlet line from the IP – is fuel coming out (Lift Pump on)? ___________
2d] Loosen an injector line and crank the engine - does fuel come out? _________
2e] Do you hear a vacuum (hiss) when you remove the fuel cap? ___________
3] PMD / IP Issues
3a] Location of PMD (on pump, on intake, remote mounted) _____stock location______
3b] Condition of Extension harness (if used) Vendor or Homemade? _____NO____
3c] Condition of grounds / ground wires to IP / PMD. Check Harness. ______IDK___
3d] PMD Make: _9__________
3e] PMD Age: _____9________
4] Stalling Issues
4a] Do you experience stalling only when hot? ______N______
4b] Does it stall under particular circumstances? (ie hit bump, or on accel) ____N__
4c] Does pouring cool water over the IP seem to help with restarting? ___N______
4d] Is stalling momentary (engine recovers)? ___N______
4e] Does SES light come on when engine hiccups? N_________
4f] Does cruise control quit working when engine hiccups? _No cruise________
4g] Does re-starting seem to reset engine, restoring cruise and power? _____N____
4h] Changes to dash lights or instruments during stalling events? _______N____
5] Running Issues
5a] On cold start, does upper rad hose get hard before engine warms up? ____IDK___
5b] Any bubbles or oil film in coolant overflow tank? ___N____
5c] Any white slime on oil surfaces (dipstick, CDR, oil Fill cap)? N__________
5d] Excessive white smoke from exhaust on cold start? ___Not really______
5e] Excessive black smoke from exhaust under hard acceleration? _____N_____
6] Performance Issues
6a] Do you have gauges? ________N___
6b] Maximum boost under load? ___What ever stock is_________
6c] Have you added a performance PCM (reflash) or Chip? _N_____________
6d] Have you changed exhaust / downpipe / crossover? ____N____________
6e] Wastegate – mechanical or vacuum? _______Stock_______
7] Temperature-related Issues:
7a] Single or dual thermostats? ______Sing______
7b] Have you replaced them lately? Manufacturer of replacements? _____N____
7c] Have you pulled and cleaned Radiator and coolers lately? _______N_____
7d] Have you replaced the fan clutch? Manufacturer of replacement? ____N____
7e] (winter) Have you tested your antifreeze? Good to what temp? _____Yes winter over_____
7f] (winter) Are you using a winter grille cover? ___N________
List and describe any other factors which are not addressed in this checklist. We can’t see, hear, smell, or touch your truck, so the more descriptive information you can give, the more likely it is that somebody can assist you.
- Truck model and class (ie: c2500) _____k3500____
- Automatic or Standard ____auto______
- Mileage: (indicate miles or km) _107k________
- Replaced parts and mods (IP, PMD, chip/PCM, TM, injectors etc) _______Nope just oil and air filt____
- Model: ‘S’ or ‘F’ engine, NA or Turbo, EGR? ___F___________
- Ambient outside temp: (indicate *C or *F) __________
- What fuel are you using? (#1 Diesel, #2 Diesel, Bio, VO, WVO, etc) ______Ultra low sulf___
- What fuel additives are you using? __Sulfer boost_________
- Where are you located? _______Youngstown area Of Ohio______
General maintenance: inspect and evaluate the condition of each. When were they last changed?
- Air filter _last yr________
- Fuel filter _last month________
- CDR Valve? __IDK_______
- Coolant – last flushed/replaced at _IDK____________
- Oil – synthetic/regular, changed at __Place purchaced at_________
- Batteries – state of charge, (matched set) replaced at __Duralast___________
- Battery cables and grounds (removed, cleaned and tightened): ___tightened___________
- Glow Plugs - how many miles on them? ___Stock______ What type? _________Stock____
- Injectors - last changed at __Stock_____________
History: (Describe how the problem first appeared.)
- What were you doing when it happened? _______Doesn't work_______
- How was the truck running fine before this problem appeared? _______Yes______
- Has this problem ever happened before? __apparently it doesn't work_____________________
- Describe any related factors that might be part of the problem. __________No over head lights____
- Have you checked for DTC (Diagnostic Trouble Codes)? (Y.N) _N___ And? ___N_____
Diagnostics:
1] Starting:
1a] Does the engine start? ______N___
1b] Does the engine crank over? _Y_______
1c] Are your batteries fully charged? __Y_______
1d] Have you removed, cleaned, and tightened all battery connections? ______Y__
1e] Does your Wait to Start light come on for a time? How long? _Y 10 sec ________
1f] Does your glow plug light come on? _______Y__ For how long? __10 sec_______
1g] Do you see smoke from the exhaust while cranking? What color? _____normal___
2] Fuel Issues (if not running):
2a] Can you hear your lift pump working? ____________
2b] Do you get a steady flow of fuel from the water drain (T-handle) ? _________
2c] Loosen the inlet line from the IP – is fuel coming out (Lift Pump on)? ___________
2d] Loosen an injector line and crank the engine - does fuel come out? _________
2e] Do you hear a vacuum (hiss) when you remove the fuel cap? ___________
3] PMD / IP Issues
3a] Location of PMD (on pump, on intake, remote mounted) _____stock location______
3b] Condition of Extension harness (if used) Vendor or Homemade? _____NO____
3c] Condition of grounds / ground wires to IP / PMD. Check Harness. ______IDK___
3d] PMD Make: _9__________
3e] PMD Age: _____9________
4] Stalling Issues
4a] Do you experience stalling only when hot? ______N______
4b] Does it stall under particular circumstances? (ie hit bump, or on accel) ____N__
4c] Does pouring cool water over the IP seem to help with restarting? ___N______
4d] Is stalling momentary (engine recovers)? ___N______
4e] Does SES light come on when engine hiccups? N_________
4f] Does cruise control quit working when engine hiccups? _No cruise________
4g] Does re-starting seem to reset engine, restoring cruise and power? _____N____
4h] Changes to dash lights or instruments during stalling events? _______N____
5] Running Issues
5a] On cold start, does upper rad hose get hard before engine warms up? ____IDK___
5b] Any bubbles or oil film in coolant overflow tank? ___N____
5c] Any white slime on oil surfaces (dipstick, CDR, oil Fill cap)? N__________
5d] Excessive white smoke from exhaust on cold start? ___Not really______
5e] Excessive black smoke from exhaust under hard acceleration? _____N_____
6] Performance Issues
6a] Do you have gauges? ________N___
6b] Maximum boost under load? ___What ever stock is_________
6c] Have you added a performance PCM (reflash) or Chip? _N_____________
6d] Have you changed exhaust / downpipe / crossover? ____N____________
6e] Wastegate – mechanical or vacuum? _______Stock_______
7] Temperature-related Issues:
7a] Single or dual thermostats? ______Sing______
7b] Have you replaced them lately? Manufacturer of replacements? _____N____
7c] Have you pulled and cleaned Radiator and coolers lately? _______N_____
7d] Have you replaced the fan clutch? Manufacturer of replacement? ____N____
7e] (winter) Have you tested your antifreeze? Good to what temp? _____Yes winter over_____
7f] (winter) Are you using a winter grille cover? ___N________
List and describe any other factors which are not addressed in this checklist. We can’t see, hear, smell, or touch your truck, so the more descriptive information you can give, the more likely it is that somebody can assist you.
- Staff
- #6
For us to help you, you should actually work and fill out the checklist. If you just fill in the blanks while sitting at your computer, it does not give us the actual mental picture that we need to diagnose your truck from across the country.
For one your truck came from the factory with dual stats.
Everybody here really wants to help you get your truck fixed. But, we need all the details we can get so we do not send you parts shopping and just replacing parts that may not need replacing.
Please fill out the checklist with as much detail as you can. The more detail we get the better help that can be offered.
Thanks,
For one your truck came from the factory with dual stats.
Everybody here really wants to help you get your truck fixed. But, we need all the details we can get so we do not send you parts shopping and just replacing parts that may not need replacing.
Please fill out the checklist with as much detail as you can. The more detail we get the better help that can be offered.
Thanks,
JMJNet
Recruit
1a] Does the engine start? ______N___
1b] Does the engine crank over? _Y_______
It looks like the engine does not start but it cranks?
That is interesting.
1b] Does the engine crank over? _Y_______
It looks like the engine does not start but it cranks?
That is interesting.
buddy
Active Member
The cruise doesnt work at all? Or it drops out of cruise a lot?
Dieseldad97
I now know why.
I've gone through a few PMD's and my cruise always worked.
Years ago on my '92 6.2L my cruise worked on and off...I just repaced it from an auto wrecker GM truck. Worked like a charm after that. Maybe it's the cruise itself?? Who knows.
Good luck!
Years ago on my '92 6.2L my cruise worked on and off...I just repaced it from an auto wrecker GM truck. Worked like a charm after that. Maybe it's the cruise itself?? Who knows.
Good luck!
JMJNet
Recruit
It is probably not your PMD.
PMD usually causes stalling and inability to start. Since yours start, it is probably not the PMD.
PMD usually causes stalling and inability to start. Since yours start, it is probably not the PMD.
BigBlueChevy
Compression Ignition Addict
according to what you filled out you are unsure of the condition of your grounds. The grounds on the 6.5 are very important and ,if not properly protected, will cause issues. Inoperable crusie control could be the beginning of a local ground not doing its job. Check your grounds first and let us know the end result.
Easiest way:
Grab a socket set, wirebrush/dremel and some anti-ox paste.
-Pull the ground off, clean up the frame and ground crimp end itself, coat the ground in a little anti-ox paste, and tighten that sun buck up real good.
Easiest way:
Grab a socket set, wirebrush/dremel and some anti-ox paste.
-Pull the ground off, clean up the frame and ground crimp end itself, coat the ground in a little anti-ox paste, and tighten that sun buck up real good.
packratt
Active Member
Somewhere on the forum is a list of all the grounds and where they are located.
Jifare can you link the list to the FAQ if it someone posts the link to the list.
Jifare can you link the list to the FAQ if it someone posts the link to the list.
ak diesel driver
6.5 driver
I had a thread on the grounds for my 96, search my threads.
- Staff
- #16
Hey guys
Grounds might be an issue... here is ak diesel driver's thread on grounds.
However, the PMD can and will cause cruise failure. Since the cruise on DS-4 models is electronic and controlled by the PCM (and not by a 'cruise control servo'), anything that causes an error condition in the PCM will kill the cruise.
For instance; a failing PMD can cause misses... little ones you can hardly feel. If a certain number of misses (failure events) occurs in a certain time frame, then the PCM defaults back to limp mode, and the FIRST thing it does is remove cruise control, to better protect the engine. Additional issues can include timing getting reset to TDC parameters, boost being cut, and fuel being cut back, but cruise is invariably the first casualty.
Shut off the truck, restart, and the re-initialized PCM will now allow cruise. Until the next multiple failure event.
If you have a code set, the cruise can be inhibited. Have you checked your codes?
Grounds might be an issue... here is ak diesel driver's thread on grounds.
However, the PMD can and will cause cruise failure. Since the cruise on DS-4 models is electronic and controlled by the PCM (and not by a 'cruise control servo'), anything that causes an error condition in the PCM will kill the cruise.
For instance; a failing PMD can cause misses... little ones you can hardly feel. If a certain number of misses (failure events) occurs in a certain time frame, then the PCM defaults back to limp mode, and the FIRST thing it does is remove cruise control, to better protect the engine. Additional issues can include timing getting reset to TDC parameters, boost being cut, and fuel being cut back, but cruise is invariably the first casualty.
Shut off the truck, restart, and the re-initialized PCM will now allow cruise. Until the next multiple failure event.
If you have a code set, the cruise can be inhibited. Have you checked your codes?
Last edited:
JMJNet
Recruit
Jifaire, is this an early sign of failing PMD? The OP said that the car is still starting and he does not experience any stalling at all usually happened with failing PMD or limp-mode PMD. At least that is what he said in the diagnostic.
Also with 2000 with under 120K, the PMD should be covered but I am not sure if it can be claim that since there is no classic PMD symptoms.
Also with 2000 with under 120K, the PMD should be covered but I am not sure if it can be claim that since there is no classic PMD symptoms.
- Staff
- #18
It could be a sign of a failing PMD, but as you said, there is no way warranty will cover it without the classic symptoms. Here's the good news; once a PMD starts to crap out, it's all downhill from there. They don't 'get better'.
That means if it IS the PMD, the symptoms will get progressively worse until he starts to have the classic symptoms and can go after warranty.
Still not sure it is, though; his cruise doesn't come and go, it's just gone. It could be grounds, it could be codes (or history codes) - your PCM doesn't always turn on the Check Engine light when you get a code, only when you get a 'non-recoverable' code... for momentary blips, you get a silent code that doesn't turn on the light, but may still interfere with the cruise. It could also be wiring, fuses, signal-light lever or switch, etc.
If the cruise is never present, you need to look at everything.
That means if it IS the PMD, the symptoms will get progressively worse until he starts to have the classic symptoms and can go after warranty.
Still not sure it is, though; his cruise doesn't come and go, it's just gone. It could be grounds, it could be codes (or history codes) - your PCM doesn't always turn on the Check Engine light when you get a code, only when you get a 'non-recoverable' code... for momentary blips, you get a silent code that doesn't turn on the light, but may still interfere with the cruise. It could also be wiring, fuses, signal-light lever or switch, etc.
If the cruise is never present, you need to look at everything.
Last edited:
JMJNet
Recruit
Trapp, you may want to pray that the PMD is gone before 120K to get a warranty replacement.
Did the truck ever get the IP or PMD replaced recently under warranty in its history?
Did the truck ever get the IP or PMD replaced recently under warranty in its history?
No I carfaxed my truck before I bought it and the last time it was in the shop was 3 years ago for oil air and the state checks in Pa. Maybe I could just buy a new turn siganal lever and see if that works clean up the grounds and what not. Before buying the new PMD.